Goal-shy QPR in need of formation revamp?

Having watched the two televised matches I am wondering how on earth Jay bothroyd ever found himself in an England squad. He looks clueless in front of goal

I thought an interesting observation made by Gary Neville yesterday related to the size of the Loftus Road pitch in that it appeared relatively small which may not be conducive to the expansive style of play which players like Wright-Phillips, Barton and Taarabt lend themselves to. It also allows opposition sides to sit relatively deep and limit the space behind and in front of the defence which may in turn see shots being hit from distance, efforts being blocked or crosses being put in from deeper positions. Particularly in the latter case, by not having enough bodies in the box these crosses are potentially fruitless and by the opposition having enough players in defensive positions, any second ball is often contested or cleared. I wonder if the size of the pitch at Wolverhampton contributed to their excellent victory allowing their forward three midfielders more time, space and opportunity to attack the penalty area?

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I was talking about this with a friend towards the end of the game yesterday. While he favoured 2 up front, I stressed that the midfield formation was the whole reason QPR had so much of the ball in the first place in the Newcastle and Villa games, certainly in the first half.

Taarabt in particular struggles to play in a 4-man midfield. I just think that when Bothroyd comes deep/wide, the attacking midfielders need to be pushing up towards goal. Warnock isn't going to abandon this system after 2 home games when it served so well last season, but it could be tweaked. Barton as you say lies a bit deep so he could potentially drop into the holding 2, probably at the expense of Derry, allowing a more forward-minded player like Smith or Campbell to give Bothroyd more support.

Interesting article Alistair... Bothroyd is a confidence player and hopefully when he gets a goal (finally!) he'll be fine. Last season for Cardiff when he was so successful I'm pretty sure he played together with a second striker - Chopra usually I think.

I was hoping we'd go to two strikers earlier than we did yesterday - but I wasn't expecting the combination to be Helguson and Campbell. We should have put Campbell on with Bothroyd but swapping these two seems to what Neil Warnock prefers at the moment. Helguson did well when he came on - he's not the tallest but wins more than his fair share in the air.

The problem with playing a more 4-3-1-2 formation is who to leave out. The one will still be Taarabt I imagine with three out of Faurlin, SWP, Barton and Derry. Despite his superb start to the season I'm afraid the one to miss out for me would be Derry which would be a shame.

Up front I'd keep persevereing with Bothroyd paired with Campbell or possibly Helguson.

In any case, we hopefuly have enough now to survive then to prosper in the Prem. Who knows - we might not even need Jason Puncheon after all...!

1. At 15:27 26th Sep 2011, rigidthedog wrote:
Having watched the two televised matches I am wondering how on earth Jay bothroyd ever found himself in an England squad. He looks clueless in front of goal
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He's similar to strikers such as Michael Ricketts and Andy Carroll. One season, or even half a season, of prolifically scoring against non-international standard defences, and they get an England call-up.

It speaks volumes about the sheer dearth of quality strikers in England.

Danny Welbeck is another English striker whose reputation is grossly exaggerated in comparison to his actual ability. He'll never make the cut as a Manchester United first-team regular, and will move to a mid-table Premiership side in a year or two.

Ha articles like this make me laugh. Are we going to have a problem scoring goals? Er yeah! Of course we are, but we're just delighted we can compete with teams like Everton, Villa and Newcastle.

We're playing the best football I've ever seen in my 25 years, we've got a great manager, an honest proactive chairman and we may, just may, stay up. I promise you if you were there for the 4-0 defeat against Bolton you'd take a misfiring striker as your main problem every day of the week!

I thought it was a pretty good game.
A draw was fair in the end.

QPR have made more signing than most so it will take time along with the fact that they have just come into the prem si they were always going to find it difficult.

But that's what makes the EPL the best league in the world!

Colin likes to change his strikers at the rate most of us change our pants so Bothroyd won't be asked to fulfil the lone striker role for long. He'll be rotated with Campbell, Helguson and whoever else until January when another couple of journeymen frontmen will be signed.

It's a shame that the QPR ownership took a while to resolve. If Fernandes was there from pre-season Warnock would have got the players he really wanted. He was desperate for Craig Mackail Smith, but Craig wanted assurances that Warnock was going to still be manager for the season to which Warnock himself couldn't guarantee.

Yup. Just missing a striker. Should have bought Crouch.

Hoopsa17 says it all. As a QPR fan I am happy for where we are right now. Tell me something, Mr Blogger: If QPR has the fourth worst shooting accuracy, how will another striker help? It'll be two players who can't score instead of one, and with less players available to create the extra chances they need. While Derry is extremely effective as the defensive midfielder, Faurlin has more free rein to roam and be creative. If you take Derry out of the line-up, Faurlin would have to play deeper, and if you take Faurlin out, we lose his creativity completely. I compare this two to Mascherano and Alonso while both were playing at Liverpool. It's a pairing that should only be split in the final 30 minutes if necessary. The team is still settling into its groove as a new squad, with 5 or 6 new first team signings a couple of weeks ago and a couple more only joining in the summer. For a team that had just 4 of its starters (Kenny, Derry, Faurlin and Taarabt) actually promoted, it has gelled extremely well. Defensively we are sound, and as we saw with Blackpool last year, that is very important. With the exception of a naive and nervous opening match against Bolton, two lucky deflections against Wigan and a penalty that never was against Villa, we have done very well defensively. Goals will come. Ask any striker that's in a rut. Remember, although Bothroyd was given an England call-up, he is still new at this level. I think we should start DJ Campbell a few times and see how he does. He's more mobile than Bothroyd and that would fit the Wright-Phillips, Barton and Taarabt line-up much better. No need to sound off the warning sirens yet. We're 9th, unbeaten in three games, and have two wins out of three away games.

Great article. It's difficult because Bothroyd, as a Striker, will be judged on his goal ratio. I thought he did a lot of good work in the first half, and was able to hold the ball up and distribute well.
The point is that he often came to recieve the ball, leaving no-one ahead of him on the pitch.
I think a switch to 442 could help at home, but we would have to use a diamond in midfield, with Adel on the left side in a more free role.
I'm a big fan of the tight pitch at Loftus Road, and the fast tempo we used in the first 30 mins showed that we can keep possesion and frustrate opposing teams.
I think the Ref spoilt the game a bit yesterday, as there were about 8 bookings in what was a fairly cleanly contested competition.
Overall though, after watching the Bolton game, I'm so happy to be dissapointed coming away from LR with draws against established teeams like Newcastle and Villa. Let's not forget that the Strikers were signed under the old regime for free, and this might get looked at again in Jan.

Come on you R's!

9. At 16:23 26th Sep 2011, Reinasbaldhead wrote:

He was desperate for Craig Mackail Smith, but Craig wanted assurances that Warnock was going to still be manager for the season to which Warnock himself couldn't guarantee.
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Mackail-Smith is a decent Championship-standard player. I don't that QPR - in the PL - ''missed out'' on signing him.

You make it sound like they almost signed Messi.

I don't think any team will have a problem scoring goals against a side which includes Richard Dunne in defence.

That's 9 career own-goals now. Own-goals or red-cards are always likely when the big lumbering Irishman is still plying his trade at a level which is a couple of notches above his footballing expertise.

@Reinasbaldhead and @boils
I'm glad we didn't get Craig Mackail Smith, he was a lot of money for a gamble, and likewise with Crouch, I'm not sure that going backwards is the best way forwards...

I would have prefered Danny Graham (now glad we didn't) or my personal fav Dembe Ba, who in the end was sold cheaply...

To me this is a premature article, the jury is still out. QPR played OK, not great, but were a match for Villa most of the time. What did concern me was Bothroyd - he looked sluggish and should have scored with the glancing header that went wide. I am sure that Warnock will sort it out. Lets be honest, 8 points is a good haul from the first 6 games, keep up that average and the R's will be fine with around 50 points for the season.

@ 13
It was well documented that Warnock wanted him and from what I've seen of QPR (just promoted from the championship) is still the type of player they need.
Not only is he a player that causes havoc in the box but runs his socks of creating space. At the moment Tarabat has not got going because he is getting no space, Bothroyd doesn't do that.

@ 17
I think Jamie Mackie (still to come back) can do this job just as well.
What we need is the Holy Grail, a proven PL goal scorer, which puts us in the same camp as about 17 other PL teams...

Something which epitomised our strike problems was when, I think it was the first half, Bothroyd broke down the left but had no-one to pass the ball to in the middle because no-one was with him and we then lost our chance to strike. I'd leave the team selection to Warnock (he seems to know what he has to do!!) I don't think we particularly need new strikers the ones we have got are sufficient, I think it's just a matter of time before everyting starts to click and we'll be scoring goals again - who cares if one player gets into double figures, I'd rather eight or nine players scored 8 or 9 goals!

disagree with part of this - taraabt is NOT an "accomplished" player, he had an amazing season in the NPC, but until he steps up and proves his worth in the Prem he cant be accomplished. especially with his new teammates of barton, wright-phillips et al he should really be beggining to step up and flourish.

it is for that very reason that he is getting dropped from my dream team this week!

(awaiting a brace of goals to prove me wrong next week.....)

Hoopsa and Michigan have this spot on. We're competing chaps!! Give us some time. This formation is best for us for now, Bothroyd will find his scoring boots, the attacking midfielders will time their runs into the box better and Joey will stop thinking that he's allowed to play anywhere he likes on the pitch and stick to his designated position. Other teams will also work us out a bit better too and it will be tough but with a little lady luck we will stay up and then we can win the league next year instead. Oh, and citing Alan Shearer's and MOTD2's hopeless analysis, where clearly all they saw was the 6 minute highlights reel, serves only to undermine your piece, not embellish it. I'm surprised we weren't being urged by the big man to get stuck in a bit more.

I am a huge fan of what QPR have done with the transfer window and I believe their team is easily good enough for an 8-14th finish. The amount of chances that are being created by Taraabt, SWP, Barton and Faurlin and being wasted by Bothroyd. When DJ Campbell has come off the bench this season he has looked nothing but hungry and a handful. Bothroyd has no killer instinct and actually has a very poor goals to games record for someone who hasn't played in the Premiership - 75 in 310 - i.e. less than 1 in 4.

If QPR had had a clinical finisher instead of Bothroyd, they would be in the top half of the table with ease right now.

The Rangers COULD do with a top goalscorer, but even more they need a fair crack from the refs. Quite apart from the 2 handball penalties there was a blatant body check by Warnock on a Rangers player following up on the great save by Given from SWP. Warnock, Collins and Petrov should all have gone for second yellows if you apply the same logic that did for Traore after his daft challenge while on a yellow. Just a fair crack. I don't think we'd have missed all 3 penalties!

21. Don't get me started on Shearer. He is the reason we lost our Prem status in the first place. First hom egame of the relegation sesason he was pushing and shoving everyone in sight while we were battering them (Blackburn) a la Newcastle and then he flopped in the box from the lightest of contacts, scored the penalty and we lost 0-1. So of course he thought that Traore touching Agbo's arm was a "nailed on penalty" it was just like the one he fiddled. If he'd played under that referee he would have had about 20 Pl goals not 200+ as he shoved someone for most of them. Can't forget, still less forgive.

For one thing Alistair, thanks for the non-ManCity-or-Arsenal post. You would think that no other clubs exist with the topics of the other bloggers at BBC covering the EPL.
I would disagree with your suggestion that Warnock needs a change in his tactics. For one thing, every one seems to be forgetting that QPR have just been promoted. Sure they may have had an infusion of cash for buying new players, and they certainly have done well in the market, no neutral is gonna expect them to do a Stoke City straight away. Warnock's first priority has got to be making sure his team survives come May. I would imagine that without the two defensive midfielders, the rangers will be very vulnerable to attacking play like the big 6 might play. The defensive setup seems to be the most efficacious one and would take QPR to somewhere around 12, from where they can build up.
That said, I still believe that Barton and Wright-Phillips are England Material. And while Taarabt seems to be looking up to Mario Balotelli (pardon the City reference, but it seemed most apt...), he looks to have the potential to be a Ranger legend provided they can keep a hold of him. I think Warnock should continue what he is doing. Sure he can take some liberties against the other newcomers or even Blackburn. But against clubs of the calibre of Villa? Not this year......

An article that echoes my own thoughts. I'm wondering whether Derry, staunch member of the Championship winning side, might be the man to give way as well. Just too limited at this level. Dundde4ever says "8 points is a good haul from the first 6 games" but that was against Bolton (H), Wigan (A), Everton (A), Newcastle (H), Wolves (A) and Villa (H) we've avoided the real big boys so far. That was the opportunity to pile up even more points. Mind you first three games was the old basically championship team. Also - yes the compactness of the pitch will hamper SWP and Taarabt, I'm wondering where and when the admirable Tommy Smith will fit in, the returning Jamie Mackie and Puncheon - lot's of wide-ish men no real spearhead. And while we're at it what is happening with Kieron Dyer? Defensive cover looks thin. Who will cover Traore? Connolly? More work needed in January window to make the Rs secure for another season.

Mrs Boothroyd and her nephew ran a Funeral business, and they were quite funny on the telly in the 70s. Remember??

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I really don't understand this urge to use a lot of newly signed players. Why change a winning team so drastic. I front Jamie Mackie will be back very soon - till then Smith and Helgusson will deliver the wanted goals (until we can get Crouch back to Loftus Road). Forget Bothroyd and minis like SWP and DJ Campbell - and don't touch the backbone of the whole team: Derry & Faurlin. . . .

Neil Warnock has one glaring weakness as a manager-he has never been able to find a striker and use them properly. He signed 47 of them in his time at Bramall Lane. All decent players. None of them did anything. Never knew how to use them. Expect to see him making desparate efforts to sign "the one" in the transfer window, buy some lumbering oaf for vastly inflated price, giving them 2 or 3 games before seding them out on loan to Chesterfield.

I agree with comment 29. I don't think the 'summer signings' were all that smart. Why did their former clubs let them go? Probably because they were aware that they'd passed their 'use by' date. Examples: in the QPR - Villa game Wright-Phillips' flattered to deceive, with a final pass that often went astray, Boothroyd was a non event, Barton is a one man show off, and D J Campbell was Blackpool's greediest player. They are all second hand - no, make that third hand, goods.

'He's similar to strikers such as Michael Ricketts and Andy Carroll. One season, or even half a season, of prolifically scoring against non-international standard defences, and they get an England call-up.

It speaks volumes about the sheer dearth of quality strikers in England.

Danny Welbeck is another English striker whose reputation is grossly exaggerated in comparison to his actual ability. He'll never make the cut as a Manchester United first-team regular, and will move to a mid-table Premiership side in a year or two.'

This is, with respect, complete bunkum. Bothroyd was called up because there was basically no-one else to call up (With basically every English striker injured) and secondly, what striker doesn't spend most of his time scoring against non-international defences? You don't ignore strikers who at the age of 22 are top scorers in December (Andy Carroll). And there isn't a complete derth of strikers. Darren Bent, Defoe, Carroll, Rooney, Sturridge, Welbeck. That's a solid line of strikers. Not as good as Argentina's list of strikers but who does have a list like that? Portugals strikers are woeful, doesn't seem to bother them. Spain's strikers have been very off boil recently and they're the best side in the world! Compared to most, England have a relatively solid list of strikers

I don't really see there to be a problem. This team just got promoted! I'm sure if you gave Warnock 8 points from his first 6 games (is that right?) He would take them. Every team wouldn't mind a good striker up top, maybe it might be an idea to put Taraabt up there on his own and play a winger who actually has defensive capabilites. Taraabt is unlikely to have the qualities of holding the ball up, but he can obviously beat a few players and get a shot off. just a thought.

IMO QPR are doing well this season beacuse of their 5-man midfield. There is no good in reverting to 442 just to score more goals, when doing so will lead to more conceeded.

We have a problem which they are familiar with at The Emirates, but, it is much less of a worry for QPR. I loved the first half against Newcastle, when they played the Toon off the pitch and the first half against Villa was also pretty good. The football has put a smile on the faces of the fans and the players seem to love it, too. That's a great start for me and I think most of the ingredients are there for a season when they simply hold their own in the Premier League. By the way, who is this wonderful striker that ought to have been signed?

Just another quick point. It is highlighted how poor QPR's shots on target ratio is... but Bolton sit second in this table and last time I looked Bolton were doing considerably poorer than QPR. Be careful how statistics are interpreted.

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You can't butcher the system. That midfield looks perfectly balanced to me with Taraabt able to do as he pleases, Derry anchoring, Faurin keeping the ball moving and Barton and SWP looking to create the chances.

All that's needed is a better centre forward which if QPR cement their top class status they will get.

I am surprised Campbell isn't starting, it's not as if Bothroyd was at QPR already and demanding of more loyalty and Campbell showed last season he has an eye for goal at this level. With the style of players at QPR's disposal I don't see they need "a big lad up front".

I can't believe people still see SWP as a top player. He did nothing on Sunday apart from run around aimlessly and mis-control the ball every time he got in a decent position. He's a very average player and is not anywhere near as good as Taarabt or Faurlin (who has really impressed me so far). Tarrabt will get going when he has players around him who can move intelligently and create space. Boothroyd is a talented player..at Championship level. He's out of his depth as a lone frontman in the PL. It's pretty difficult to be sucessful at that role, so it's no major shame that he can't play it. DJ Campbell is a much more natural out and out striker, with the movement and work rate to match.

I've also always been a fan of Puncheon, he has bags of skill and talent and I think he could yet go on to become a 'sleeper' top level player. He has more ability than SWP anyway. Also Jamie Mackie showed some real potential last season. Tommy Smitrh is someone who plays with a lot of intelligence and experience, and he's always coming up with concrete goals and assists, a cutting edge.

I don't get this current trend of promoted clubs buying Championship strikers. Brendan Rodgers must be mad if he thinks Danny 'the snail' Graham will cut it at PL level. Ditto Jay Bothroyd. Hanging your hat on players like this in the PL is fanciful. QPR will do well once Warnock swallows his pride and accepts that Bothroyd was a waste of money and SWP simply isn't a good player. I've always strangely been a fan of Warnock, although I thought his insults at Traore were out of order, and I always lose respect for anyone that thinks SWP is one of his teams best players.

LOL at comment 30 - I'll be amazed if Warnock doesn't make a move for Rob Hulse, Richard Cresswell and Dele Adebola in January. He does seem to have a bit of a 'problem' with buying too many strikers.

Comment 38 (and 30),

Yes I agree, although he already has Rob Hulse at the club.

When he went up with us, Warnock got carried away with being a Premiership manager, and seems to be doing the same thing again. I think you'll stay up because you have a much better squad than we did, but Warnock's tactical nouse at Premiership level is suspect.

Cue nervy end of season for QPR fans, when he decides to play Taarabt a right-back.

Personally feel that we should have tried to sign Michael Owen, even if it was just a loan deal until January. Would have definitely provided the goals against the clubs around us.

#40 @QPR4EVR
Really?
I bet our Physios are not jumping for joy at that prospect! ;p
-Personally, I don't think Owen would be a great fit in the team. I'd rather see us build for the future than burden ourselves with an older player on a huge contract, who may not play every game.

Awful article which overlooks key points most important of all our defensive strength that the current system gives. It's all too easy to suggest ways to be more attacking while paying no attention to the effect this will have the other end of the pitch.

We (QPR) have had the new signings for three games in which we have conceded one goal from a penalty that should never have been given.

The defensive strength is our foundation. The team has been together three games and is still finding its feet going forward. As well as scoring 19 goals Taarabt also had 18 assists last year. He hasn't hit form yet but it's only a matter of time.

The goals will come but fortunately our defence provides the base we need. It is because of this base we were able to dominate Wolves and Newcastle in the way we did and were undoubtedly the better team against Villa. The credit owed for this is missing entirely

I don't think the formation is the issue, its more to do with the positioning of Barton, SWP and Bothroyd.

Bothroyd, often came deep to collect the ball, then once he laid it off, he often tried to stay in the play rather than sprinting off into position against the defensive line.

SWP has to get in the box more particularly when play is on the other side of the field.

Barton also has to get in the box more. I also think QPR look more balanced when Barton is in the middle of the three and Taarabt on the left

What matters is that QPR are in the best league in the world.(in addition we are playing good footy)
There are enough teams which will struggle, as well as QPR.
Blackburn
WBA
Norwich
Swansea
Bolton
Wolves
Wigan

I cannot see why QPR play Jay Bothroyd,in the last game he had three clear cut chances and missed the lot and in last nights game was so bad that it had us spurs fans doubled up,the manager should have removed him long before he did,I think there defence looks okay,and they need one player in the mid field plus a goal scorer up front ,then they will finish about mid table which is great for a club in its first season

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I'm speaking my mind so watch out.

Defensively, so far Young, Anton and the disgrace (Traore) have been expert buys.

Midfield SWP brings us something we've lacked for ages: pace. Villa looked nervous whenever he got fed out wide, and same with Wolves and the geordies. Faurlin is great at creating for SWP, Adel, DJ, Jay etc. Derry always gives 100% Barton has brought in a new dimension to midfield, and Adel is Adel. (LEGEND) But I personally think we need to up front, and I can't see 3-5-2 and Adel's free role is an asset offensively for us so I reckon 4-3-1-2 suits us perfectly. This would mean taking out someone, and sadly, Shaun will probably be out. Though teams like City, Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea go back to 4-3-2-1.

Bothroyd needs goals. Cofidence is what he thrives on so maybe a 30-20 mins to go on as sub? (if we stick with 4-3-2-1 as we all expect) DJ has really impressed me in his 2 proper games, and Adel and SWP works better for him. Hedair is alright, substituted on when we play the big 6 and Rob Hulse....... don't get me started




Team (My opinion)
Paddy
Young Gabs Anton Traore

Ale Faurlin
Barton SWP
Adel
DJ
Jay

OF COURSE JOEY SWP ADEL WILL ALL SWITCH PLACES, WHICH HOPEFULLY WILL SEEM LIKE HARDWORK TO SOMEONE LIKE TITUS BRAMBLE (don't get me wrong quality player.)

Bothroyd looks more of a provider than a goal scorer. His crossing and movement on Sunday were excellent as was his hold up play. I just can't see him scoring that many though, he is slow to get in the box and always seems to have the ball under his feet when a sharp chance comes his way. DJ would be a better bet when it comes to putting the ball in the net.

um yeah in my comment shaun derry not shaun wright phillips. sorry for any inconvinience if you're reading this SWP.