FA Cup never loses magic

the FA cup has been de-valued, but the teams that do.. like the top 4 or the teams fighting relegation have a reason to do it... the CL n the PREM are all too important to the top clubs, look at liverpool, think every fan will quite happily go out of the FA, LEAGUE and CL cups to get their hands on the PREM, stoke are relegation candidates with a team looking likely to implode n stayin in the PREM means a whole lot more than a few games in the FA cup

i like the cup but it does come down my list of priorities in a season, just ahead of the league cup but a million miles behind the CL and the PREM

for teams that are in the lower leagues n are mid table in the prem, wer they aint gonna go down, they aint gonna get into europe, its a great opportunity to get a fair bit of cash n even a route into europe, n the way i look at it is, if teams like arsenal treat it as a comp for the youngsters to be blooded in then it is going to give the lesser teams achance to get further, or as last season give us unexpected finalists n winners, which in turn gives the mid table teams a shot at europe.. the top 4 are always gonna get that

I will never forget listening to the radio on a Monday lunchtime at school to hear 'who got who' in the next round, whereas now I have eagerly awaited the draw on the internet with just as much enthusiasm 40 years later. The FA Cup will always, for me, have something that no other competition can ever match. My memories of Mansfield Town in the 60's will last forever.

I agree it never loses its magic.

But if the BBC were that bothered about it they wouldn't have lost the television rights to ITV.

It's still the one trophy whose final everyone will watch if they have the chance, every year in May. Even people who don't care about football watch the FA Cup final. It's one of those annual events you just have to experience.

I should start by saying that I so rarely find myself able to agree with anything that Phil McNulty writes. No surprise then that I could nto disagree more with this romantic eulogy for the FA Cup.
In my opinion there is absolutely no doubt that the FA Cup has been seriously devalued. It just does not carry the interest that it once did and one fact and one fact alone proves it - the declining crowds that matches in the competition draw.
The cause? The main cause in my view is the huge growth of interest in the Premiership. This has left the FA Cup seemingly unimportant in comparison. Add to this other factors: the decision to play semi-finals at Wembley thus devaluing the interest, importance and impact of the final match; the decision to dispense with replays in the semi-finals and second replays in earlier rounds; the consequent introduction of the dreaded penalty shoot outs; more recently, the decision to give the TV rights to a second rate terrestial channel and, worse still, to a very expensive pay channel. All these factors mean the magic has gone and only dreamers caught up in the romance of one-off, giant-killing results think otherwise. Get real - the FA Cup needs a major injection of something special to reignite interest or it will slowly wither on the vine.

Phil, the FA Cup is brilliant.
But what makes it even more sweet is when the Qualifying Rounds in August.
I was at a Nuneaton Town game in the Qualifying Round.
I wouldnt think that I would be watching or ever see a 3rd Round match after I was robbed of the chance in 2005 when Nuneaton faced Middlesbrough.
However I did yesterday, went to the FA Cup 3rd Round match between Leicester and Palace.
I think Leicester will go far and went to the previous 2 Rounds of the Cup Against Stevenage and Dagenham in November/December.
Also ITV have been far better on coverage terms then the BBC ever will be....also Man Utd havent been on ITV YET!

Phil - you're absolutely right

Harry Hill is hilarious, oh - and you're right about the FA Cup too.

Interesting comment there, Mr. McNulty. I think the Liverpool players and fans will be keen to beat Everton...but being a Spaniard, Rafa's first priority may well be beating Real Madrid in the Champions League. He'll probably spend more mental energy plotting his tactics for that game than the Everton one.

Time will tell!!

why isn't it posting

To #4,

You wrote "It's still the one trophy whose final everyone will watch if they have the chance, every year in May. Even people who don't care about football watch the FA Cup final. It's one of those annual events you just have to experience."

Are you really sure abou this? Final without a top4 team means something is missing - and that something is callled QUALITY. Remember last year final between Portsmouth & Cardiff? It was a dull 90+ minutes without any spark whatsoever.

I love football and I go yo matches. I watch MOTD every week. If I am to go out I will set the recorder and watch it when i got home, even at 3am in the morning.

But I didn't watch the Cup final last year as I was busy doing my garden....

I think Liverpool V RealM in the Ch/L is the magic you have been talking about, not
The FA Cup, from my point of view(I'm from Syria and watch many cups, but you always overrate your team(National) players and FA Cup, just because it's a domestic Cup, you biased tv pundits call it magic, but I say it's 'tragic.
The Mersyside FA cup clash will lose it's value when Liverpool have to play Everton and Chelsea before and after the tie respectively, so do you think Rafa will be tempted by your sweet words about the FA Cup, will he field a team of Gerrard J.Carragher and Torres, NO!
It's an ordinary Cup competition and it's getting devalued( ask Rafa who fielded week teams for this cup in the past years), and to us the Liverpool fans !
We have the feeling that this year is our's, so we see this cup as a disruption ahead of our tie against Chelsea in the League that will have a big say on our title ambitions, with the Real clash next I care less about your aging cup, furthermore we the Liverpool fans are ready to even sacrifice the Champions League in return for the EPL, so you're asking us about the FA cup

I agree with McNulty. The FA Cup is magic.

To me it's never been about the big teams anyway, it's been about the little guys. The FA Cup allows any team and any player to live the dream and be a famous footballer for just one match.

For many players it's one of the highlights of their careers. Telling their kids about the time they played against Man Utd at Old Trafford in the Premier League.

It's just a shame there's no Match of the Day this year because Match of the Day is the home of football on TV, no other channel is going to match it's reputation.

I disagree with no. 6 although find part of his reasoning OK. I suspect his moans (of which some are valid - semi finals at wembley for cashflow reasons only - and some are not - Setanta showing several ties when a terrestorial broadcaster still shows a match on free air to view does not seem too bad) indicates that deep down he still loves the magic of the cup, just that it is not so magical as his memories.

I think we are in danger, if we don't have already, a two tier football support. You have the Premiership fans and then you have everybody us. I think the way each group espouses its views are different although I still think each group loves the FA Cup but just shows it in different ways.

For everybody else the third round is probably the best round of the cup. Even if your team has already been knocked out, you watch the results or listen to the radio to see which of the charlie big teams are struggling. I support Exeter City but was still interested to see Torquay excel and can even begrudgingly feel sympathy for Plymouth Gargoyles excellent away support, as deep down even I hoped they beat Arsenal (although I wanted them to win 1-0 or lose 11-0 so I could be happy either way).

The Premiership fans will role out their usual litany of excuses for defeat - it's more important to stay in the league, challenge for the league, challenge for champions league etc. etc. But the fact these excuses are given hides the fact they are out of a cup they like otherwise they would be completely ambivalent and not offer any opinions as they would not care.

So, I suspect one group looks at the cup with optimism and the other group looks at it in fear (until of course their big team gets to a final then they change how they speak).

Finally, with Everton playing Liverpool, to those who doubt the big boy fans do care, notice how the atmosphere at this game will be a lot more special than the week in week out atmospheres at either's ground.

Following up a later comment, what a bizarre perception that something that relies purely on luck should be pointed to by Mr McNulty as a measure of the weight and significance of the competition. If the fact that Liverpool have drawn Everton is somehow indicative of the magic of the FA Cup then those that promote this romantic notion are relying on the rules of chance to support their somewhat questionable belief. By the rules of probability alone, the draw can usually be relied upon to produce some mouth watering ties (those of us who do not support Liverpool might be equally inspired by Derby county playing Nottingham Forest), but if the draw had failed to produce any exciting looking ties I would find it difficult to use this as an argument for stating that the FA Cup has lost its magic. There are other reasons why the FA Cup has not got the appeal it once had and by the same token it is just ridiculous to point to the draw as evidence that the magic remains.

The best thing about your blog Phil is that you interact with us the fans and you post replys to us, so thanks

"I suspect many fans are happy to devalue the FA Cup once their team has been knocked out of it. They are not so quick when their team is still involved."

-------------------------------------------

Why do people always trot this out as if it's some kind of double standard? It isn't. It's perfectly logical. When my team gets knocked out of the FA Cup, I get over it pretty quickly because it's just not a priority. But when we get to the latter stages, I obviously want us to go on and have the big day at Wembley and hopefully win it.

Basically, if we get knocked out, it's no big deal because the FA Cup doesn't matter as much as other trophies. But when we win it, of course I'm chuffed!

Sorry, but the FA Cup has long since had its day. I can't even remember who Portsmouth beat in the final last year - was it Bristol City or WBA? I used to remember every single thing about finals in the 80's when I first started following the game - goals, commentary, the players sodding about on boating lakes at the hotel, etc.

It's like fans of a rock group, who are 4 albums past their commercial and creative peak, desperately claiming their heroes are as relevant as ever. Or people who claim snooker still has the public's attention. Life moves on - deal with it.

Phil should consider writing a column about how columns about the FA Cup being a national treasure are becoming national treasures in their won right.

The magic of the FA Cup shall forever live on in the hearts and souls of football fans across the country.

It shows how much the BBC cared about retaining the rights of the cup. ITV's coverage of the FA Cup tie between Gillingham V Aston Villa was great, the enthusiasm looked genuine and the emphasis on lower league clubs was good to see.

Thank god I won't be seeing Manchester United every week with the continous bias ramblings of John Motson on the BBC.

Long live the FA Cup - Up the Spurs!

To 12#, if you were gardening rather than watching the cup final then how did you know it was a poor cup final?

Having a final that is not entertaining because it is two teams outside the big 4 does not point to a lack of quality. It merely points to an individual poor game.
How many years of poor finals were there before West Ham v Liverpool, yet most of those were between the big teams!

"The Mersyside FA cup clash will lose it's value when Liverpool have to play Everton and Chelsea before and after the tie respectively, so do you think Rafa will be tempted by your sweet words about the FA Cup, will he field a team of Gerrard J.Carragher and Torres, NO!"

In your dreams, do you really think that Carragher and Gerrard would be happy at missing this match!!! Expect the fat Spanish waiter to put out a full strength team for this game. A Merseyside derby in the FA Cup is what the competition is all about, passion and pride. As you said EL-Liverbird your from Syria, and probably don't understand the importance of the FA Cup as an institution in the English game, like most of your fellow Norwegian fans.

The FA Cup has only been devalued by the so called big 4, and teams understandably worried about relegation from the Premiership. But for everybody else it is, and always will be, a great competition. Hartlepools result yesterday,plus Southends and Forest,are results that those fans will remember for ever. Just as I will always remember winning a semi final at Hillsborough in 1974, even better I was at St James's in 1978 when Blyth were finally beaten by Wrexham,having already become the 1st non-league team to go into the draw for the 1/4 finals.
Ok i also saw the Hereford game, but that's what the Cup is about. The memories,and even the big 4 can't take them away.
LONG LIVE THE F.A CUP, and if ferguson doesn't like it, he dosn't have to enter.

The FA Cup is an anachronism which has no place in today's modern game. The Premier League is the only completion that matters and these weekends of FA Cup play interrupt what really counts.

The Premier League clubs have nothing to gain and everything to lose. Even if my team has a good cup run, it is still a distraction from securing the highest possible placing in the Premier League.

The FA Cup is just typical of our British mentality; in that we think it is the best in the world just because it is the oldest. The argument about giving the minnows a chance is a false one – Do you really want to see a Crewe vs Northampton FA Cup Final. Why do we have to endure these one-off games which at the end of the day are meaningless.

i honestly think that rafa will keep player on the bench for the everton game, saving them for the chelsea game... rafa will never b spoken in the same sentence as the likes of shankly n paisley until he wins the league, he knows this n he'll put more effort into the league game than everton, we wont drop 3 points in that game, we'll just loose face, i hate loosing to everton as much as the next scouser n i love playbing them too, but in the grand scheme of things loosing taht game n keeping a good team up for the chelsea game is more important atm

I am a Liverpool fan and was lucky enough to go the final in 2006, which was quite arguably the greatest in living memory, and in my mind was equal with Istanbul.

Our road to the final that year was also one of the most entertaining runs i have ever seen: 5-3 at Luton, 1-0 against Man U and 7-0 against Birmingham spring to mind.

All of these matches were perfect examples of what FA Cup football is all about and the final itself was full of drama, supreme skill and heart-in-mouth football. When Gerrard scored with just seconds to go i hugged a complete stranger. That is what the FA Cup is all about.

Of course some clubs don't take the cup as seriously as they once did because of the influence of continental club competitions but try telling that to Forest Green, or Blyth Spartans, or the likes of Millwall, Southampton, West Ham and Cardiff who have reached the final in recent years. Hell, try telling the fans of the clubs outside the big 4, all 758 of them in this year's competition, that the cup means nothing to them.

And to #12 who wrote

"Are you really sure abou this? Final without a top4 team means something is missing - and that something is callled QUALITY. Remember last year final between Portsmouth & Cardiff? It was a dull 90+ minutes without any spark whatsoever."


Well look at the year before last, when Chelsea played Man Utd. Or when Arsenal played Man U in 2005. So called quality matchups that produced cures for insomnia. There's something about seeing different teams making it to the final and/or winning it.

Manchester United to win the FA Cup!

We think it is an anachronism? If you are abroad on a day when the FA Cup is on TV, you will see it live on a local channel - not just satellite. It is really popular worldwide.

I watched last year's final in a very crowded bar in Seoul and the locals were just as keen.

For most countries, their national cup competition resembles our Carling Cup - low attendences, fringe players etc. But the FA Cup still draws in the crowds.

longhornman (comment 26)

you sir are the living embodiment of all that has gone wrong with our culture. you american lover, slave to marketing.

4 teams aside, the premiership is a bastian of mediocrity. to suggest that you would gain more pleasure from seeing newcastle attain the heady heights of 14th in the premiership than through a run to wembley shows you for the passionless robot that you are.

take your obese, malnourished kids to mcdonalds for a treat, take them of your depressed wifes hands for a bit.

heres to the magic of the cup ;-)

"the FA Cup, in his eyes, is finished. The glory days, or the glory glory days as he would call them, are gone."

Correct

I think post #15 hit onto a good point by saying there's two tiers of supporters. It does seem that there are a number of people who only follow the big clubs who have lost an interest in the FA Cup. However, the vast majority of fans outside this bracket see it as an essential element of English football.

Any competition that allows the small teams to play against the big boys is magical. I'm an Exeter City fan and one of my greatest memories was going to Old Trafford a few years ago and seeing our team come away with a draw. We then got to see Man United's big guns at home (Who'd have dreamt of watching Rooney and Ronaldo at St James Park!), but even then they could only beat us 2 - 0. As well as the stories for the grandchildren, these two games saved our club from bankruptcy and going out of business. Tell me that isn't magic.

The followers of bigger teams might put the FA Cup behind the Premiership and the Champions League, but I find it arrogant to say it's lost its magic. For the vast majority of the football community in the country - from your lowest levels of non-league up into the professional divisions - the FA Cup provides hope and dreams and glory, and isn't that what football is all about?

Phil,

I agree, the FA Cup is still special. I support Stockport and Chelsea and would rather win the FA Cup than get promoted / finish 2nd instead of 4th. You don't get a trophy for qualifying for the Champions League, and winning silverware is what football should be about.

I think ITV's coverage has been excellent, with the caveat that they have fewer matches than the BBC did. The only change I'd make is to bring back semi-final replays, maybe to be played at Old Trafford or the Millennium Stadium.

The FA Cup is a great competition. I'm really looking forward to Liverpool's cup-tie with Everton - can't beat a cup derby match for atmosphere! I'm sure that the fans of Forest and Derby will be relishing their 4th round clash, as well.

People who have a downer on the FA Cup have no soul.

i may be a big 4 fan (united), but to me the FA Cup is still magic.THough i understand SAF's reasoning, I get annoyed whenever we we field a weaker team, knowing full well that any team would absolutely love to knock us out, and im still gutted whenever we dont win. I watched gillingham vs villa today at home, and it was brilliant watching them going toe to toe with villa, to the point i was on the edge of my seat hoping gillingham got a last minute equaliser. These are two teams that i nethier follow or care much about, so why i was so dissappointed when gillingham lost?

For me thats the magic of the Fa cup

I haven`t lived in England for  40 years so it is sad to hear that the FA Cup has lost it`s luster. I well remember my trips to Wembley in 1965 and 1966 to see Liverpool and Everton win the trophy. Those were fantastic trips to the Capital as we made them into weekends we would talk about for ever. In 1966 when Everton won the Cup Liverpool won the League and both supporters were in heaven.                       The third round starting in January was always very exciting and became more exciting as our team progressed. When they were eliminated we would always say " at least now we can concentrate on the League". Sad to think that those days aregone.                                                                     

so a liverpool v everton cup tie will be just another run of the mill game eh!,try getting a ticket,same at derby v forest, a sell out. and while we are on the subject try telling a forest ,hartlepool or a southend supporter that the fa cup has lost it's magic they'd tell you go away in no uncertain terms,long may it continue and phil if you want to go to see a team play football get a ticket for the millwall/crewe replay.

I'd love to get excited about the FA Cup... but those penny-pinchers on the Board of Birmingham City who've failed to install under-soil heating ruined the weekend for us Wolves fans, and mean that everything feels a bit empty right now....





....but it IS a great competition!

Why do you think unlanced boils are funny? I don't think unlanced boils are funny.

what devalued it for me was in the 2003 final when Henry thought it would be clever to hold the ball up in the corner flag to time waste in the 75 minute! also that year Arsenal never had A FA cup parade though Islington, it was cancelled. How sad as that was the only thing they won that season!
Also ITV doing the draw before all the games have been played again!

sorry but even these so called two tier football fans, im a Man U fan and wen we went out last year i was gutted, and wen we lost to chelski - gutted, so big 4 fans many actualy do want to win this, + it doesnt meen much to the teams and managers . . hmm . . try telling tht to SAF last year wen he and Quieroz had to explain there rants at going out over the red decision yep they rolled over and accepted it ermm not . .

Well, I'm a Pompey fan and the competition gave me the day out I waited 32 years for. To those who denigrate the cup, write to your club and tell them you don't want to enter it this year or ever again. That way you can leave football to those who actually care about the sport. To the same people I would like to remind you that there is life outside the endless Top Four media circus, in fact it is a vibrant life brimming with its own passions and dreams. If all you think of football is the Top Four and the CL then you have the blinkers on that Sky want you to have, good luck to you because I think you're extremely poor in terms of football experience. In that 32 years I saw my modest club rise from the bottom division to win one of only 3 competitions available to us each year, only two of which we could have realistically won. If the rest of the English (and Welsh) teams in the leagues bore you by competing against each other ,please, just sod off and let us get on with having a great time.

Play Up Pompey

The FA Cup may be undervalued by the "big" clubs but for many it remains one of the highlights of the season.

As a Sutton United fan it provides that one moment each season where we're guaranteed a mention on the tele for beating Coventry back in 1989.

This season, we came through 4 qualifying rounds to get to the first round, losing 1-0 at home to Notts County, a side three divisions above us. After a shocking couple of seasons on the pitch, the excitement the cup run generated at the club was huge - and this is the same thing that makes the cup great for most supporters around the country.

Whether like me, your hope is that you can make the competition proper and beat a pro side or whether, as a Championship or L1/2 fan, you're looking for an odds-defying run to the latter stages of the competition, we're after that same thing - a bit of glory for the club we support through thick and thin.

If I supported a Prem team, I'd go into everyone season wanting to win the FA Cup and I'm sure that's still true of most Prem fans, even if weakened teams suggest it doesn't top the clubs' priorities.

But whatever other fans think of the FA Cup, I love it, and look forward to it every season.

Ok heres a question to all:

Is the FA Cup as glorified as it was pre-Premier League?

To me its a No. The reasons being numerous. It started with the formation of the Premier League. This led to more money being input to the league thus making league position more important, in terms of revenue. Then came the formation of the Champions league. This really put a dent in the FA Cup as even more money meant that this is the trophy everyone aspires to, and why not??

I did prefer having the Cup Winners Cup as that was a more exclusive cup to win. I remember the first European final i watched was Man Utc v Barcelona in the 1991 CWC Final. If this competition was around today, these 2 teams would never be in it!

Though with the FA Cup you can play teams in ur country down 3 or 4 divisions above/below ur own league. Which is going to be interesting, but perhaps lacks quality compared to say an Arsenal v Barcelona type game. So for the viewers, the Champions league will contain better quality (obviously i'm not talking about EVERY game, just a generalisation).

Does the FA cup still have "magic?" Just ask Liverpool and Chelsea conquerers Barnsley.

Though ticket prices tend to be higher than Premiership games which is another reason why attendances are down, especially as season ticket holders have to pay extra.

Regarding 2nd string players, Man Utd played a few reserves against Southamption - a team that are struggling in the Championship. If your team are Champions, in the champions league, and are in the top 4 of the Premiership, surely u can't be afraid to use ur reserves to take on a side like Southampton. An away visit to Gillingham is a more trickier issue (crampt pitch, bobbling surface, hostile atmosphere).

So i think in the context of Phil McNulty's column that he fails to acknowledge recent events that have affected the FA cup.

His quote "It is still a competition that provides lifelong memories if your teams wins it" is laughable. Ask Man Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea or Arsenal fans to recount any of their FA Cup Final appearances since 1995 and you'll find fans struggling to recount them (aside from maybe the great games of Liverpool v West Ham, Liverpool v Arsenal when Owen scored twice, or the abysmal Man Utd v Chelsea FA cup final at "new" Wembley.

Mr McNulty then states: "It is still the competition that gives you anxiety when your team draws opponents from the lower or non-league". Maybe this is true of a team other than the "Big Four". I know watching Aston Villa v Gillingham how nervous Villa were. But then the big four fear no one, aside from maybe each other.

So the FA cup is no longer what it once is. Is it exciting? Yes. Is it a national treasure? Not really, considering the fact its on ITV and Setanta i really couldn't care less about the FA Cup this year as both Channels have such appaulingly bad coverage (Anyone who think Setanta or ITV have better coverage needs their head checked!). But is the FA Cup still exciting? For Sure.

The odd thing about the FA cup that up until 1989 only the final was on TV both BBC 1 and ITV. In 1989/90 the BBC showed both semis live and I don't think it was until 1991/92 season that sky brought the rights and started to show matches from round 3 onwards. This meant that nearly all the matches were played at 3pm on Saturday except the ones that had to be rearranged for Police safety reasons if 2 local teams had home ties. Although both Saints and Pompey played their 4th round matches at home on the same day at 3pm last season which must be A first!

Phil - I know what its like to go to a Qualifying Rounds of the Cup as pointed out.
I went to 5 FA Cup rounds at Nuneaton Borough and to go in August to an FA Cup 2nd Qualifying Round is very unusual.
You go there, a few hundred are there and you know that the team wont get to the final but the FA Cup is special.
Maybe next year McNulty, come to Liberty Way for a FA Cup Qualifying game, the FA Cup games at Nuneaton are brilliant what ever the result, you wont be disappionted!

yeap, the FA Cup is the beautifullest of them all (even though Italians think their football is the best!).

No 38
May 1968, the ball comes to Astle on the edge of the box, he strikes it with his left foot. the result is
1

To me the magic of the Cup never went. The great thing about the FA Cup is that it is exciting and unpredictable right from the qualifying rounds to the final. Who'd have thought last season that Havant would take the lead twice at Anfield or that the final would be between Pompey and Cardiff.

Those who say the magic has gone from the FA Cup are just the typical 'modern football is rubbish' brigade. Every year they thankfully get proved wrong.

No 38
May 1968, the ball comes to Astle on the edge of the box, he strikes it with his left foot. the result is
1 He falls on his a*se, as he should have done
2 it goes for a throw in, as it could have done
3 It flies into the top right corner for the cup winning goal.

Yes, i'm a baggies fan, expat to boot.

The coverage of the final here in the 3rd world is poor, with no preamble, just starting coverage as the teams are ready for the kickoff. no anthems, no "Abide with me". I still wouldn't miss it.

Yes some games are of mediocre quality, but how many of each EPL teams 38 lerague matches are likewise?

Tell me who devalues the cup? 3rd round, 2 of the great EPL players came on a subs, Torres and Rooney. Yes both LFC and MUFC fielded weaker than normal teams, but still stronger teams than they put out in the last ECL games. I reckon of the MUFC team only 5 would start if it had been a league game against LFC, but still good enough to win through to the next round.

You one eyed one club supporters, who think the FA cup is a waste of time, you are not football fans.

If you want the real majic back in the FA cup, support UEFA's plans to make the 4th qualifying ECL place, the winners of the FA cup.

Football is too much about money.

You can’t possibly expect some of the armchair or 'so called' supporters to love the FA Cup as much as the proper fans do. All they know is the pure greed of the bloated Premier League. There are those who state that the Prem and CL are priorities. It wasn’t always the case. Even sadder are the likes of Hull, Stoke and Reading. What is the ultimate goal for these clubs? To (get to) and stay mid-table in the top flight? They will never win the League or finish top 4. Even if they get to the UEFA Cup, which is the best they can hope for, they will play weakened sides, so that they can concentrate of staying in the Prem for another season. What a sad, miserable, pointless existence that is. Instead of actually going full throttle for a cup run and possible victory, which will ensure glory and memories (all that really matters for us as football fans in the long term), they play weakened sides and chance going out, so that they can tread water for ever and ever. I feel sorry for them and have lost all respect for the likes of Brown, Coppell and Pulis. English mangers who should have been aware of the heritage and history of this wonderful competition. Sadly, football is now a business, nothing more. The FA Cup still means the world to an awful lot of people but the more managers, clubs and ‘fans’ who treat it poorly, the more it is devalued. Those bad-mouthing the Cup, feel free to keep your Premier and Champions League. Enjoy your preening, overrated, overpaid, prima donnas dancing around the football pitch, people who don’t give you a second thought, when they’re sitting in their mansions and driving their super-cars. Personally, I’d rather watch a cup competation which still retains some of the drama, romance, tradition and love of the game.

I think that it's really sad that BBC have sold the rights to ITV because I always loved the cup on BBC... I'm glad the F1 has come to BBC though. I hate clubs that field weakened teams in the FA cup because it devalues it. I like to see a Torquay or Kettering get to the Semi-Finals but as a Villa fan I obviously want Villa to win the FA cup!

Much as though I hate the fact, the FA Cup just doesn't mean what it did 25 years ago.

When I was a kid it was pretty much the equivalent of winning the league. There's no where near that level of importance placed on it now.

There is still the fun of seeing teams from different divisions/leagues going head to head, but that doesn't make up for it's loss in value.

The key change has been the champions league. With only one team qualifying for the old European Cup, big teams had to take the FA Cup (and a route in to the Cup Winners Cup) seriously. Nowdays it's all about finishing in the top four.

lol, just read post #53

I'm (obviously) an armchair supporter!

Have to say that I take your point, it's a fair one.

The FA Cup is a cheap route into the UEFA Cup. Almost always (last year being an exception) the losing finalist gets the Europen place - remember when Millwall got into Europe via the FA Cup! Ludicrous!

Last year's FA Cup was a farce

To any fan trying to see a match at all 92 league grounds the FA cup is a fantastic way of filling the gaps if you are trying to do the 92 watching the same team.

People can say what they like about the cup losing it's value and ok some of the big teams do put out weakened teams, but apart from portsmouth last year it has been one of the big four that has always won it in recent years.

As a Nottingham Forest fan that lives in London yet still goes to most games the FA cup gives us a restbite from the precarious position we are in the League.

I went to Manchester yesterday hoping that we were not embarressed and would put in a good performance and we go and win 3-0 we have won by 4 goals all season. I won't forget yesterday for a LONG LONG time. 6000 forest fans singing and dancing, dreaming of a cup final in wembley it was the magic that is the FA cup.

Also the FA cup draw today looking at the teams coming out willing a team from London if i am honest never thinking about Derby away, then with only 4 teams left out came derby i held my breath can we really get them YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

running round the lounge on the phone to my mates thinking of going back to pride park not only to qualify for the 5th round, but also to win the Clough cup.

Don't tell me the FA cup has lost it's magic!

The FA cup is still a fabulous competition. 3 years ago I spent 8 hours in total on various forms of transport in order to stand in the bitterly cold winds and rain at the Deva stadium in Chester to watch my team (Nottingham Forest) be comprehensively beaten 3 - 0. You know what? I'd do it again in an instant....

You never know when a tie like Man City is going to turn up and leave you absolutely elated after 90 minutes because your players play out of their skin....

And to all the people who think it's boring not to have one of the "big 4" teams in the final....football in the Football League is infinitely more exciting than in the Premiership. There are always goals, always excitement and always a sense that on the day anybody can beat anybody.....

That last part is obviously just like the FA cup itself...

As long as smaller teams are playing bigger teams, and beating the bigger teams, it will always be a fantastic competition.

Recently in the later stages it was becoming too predictable but the shocks last year, and the absence of even one of the big four in the semis, made it arguably the best FA Cup ever. I think it will be a long time before we see only one premiership team in the semis again.

One thing that has dampened it a little this season is ITV's awful coverage. They started well with highlights of FGR - Derby then one of the shocks of the round (Forest - Man City) was mentioned in passing. Apart from a few matches all we saw from each game was just the goals. So I have no idea whether Chelsea drew with Southend because of poor finishing, bad luck, inspired defending, whatever. All I know is that Kalou scored for Chelsea then Southend equalised late on with a header.

For me the FA Cup cannot come back to the beeb soon enough. To be honest even channel five could do a better job. Sorry if that sounds too much like a rant but it was something which really spoiled the third round for me.

Love the FA cup sunderland into the fourth round at last for the first time in three years i took my nephew to the game he is only 6 and he loved it his first memeory of a football match will be a win and he now has a compettion to keep him intreseted in following sunderland for the next few months. as for mill wall levdavidovich they deserved their chance they won their matches including beating us in the semi finals at old trafford that is how the cup works your team on the day if your team dosent fancy it on amuddy pitch or handle a tough tackleing team three divisions below them then tough you bow your way into europe you blow your chance to play in the only televised football game that day somebody else goes into floklore. Its just a shame thet the FA blew things with their ever grasping for cash with a now synonomous london wembley forever tarnished in many peoples mind some how more seats mean less for fans of the teams than the old wembley but pop stars and over rich market traders can eat prawn caviar and swig champers with absolutley no idea of the event they are witnessing. lets hope this years results are as good as last years keeping the competition interesting and alive with premier league mid table up for grabs securing your chance into europe with the cup wouldnt be bad thing to spice things up.

If I have to say so myself, I'm glad it has been de-valued to the top four. If they were to take it like they do champions league knockoutr stages then it would be almost boring like much of the title race is nowadays.

They think it is less important,

therefore,

they play weaker teams and are more lax, with their approach,

therefore,

the chances of an upset is greater for teams, who do give it their all,

thus

the magic is kept alive!

My simple and basic comment is about being a young boy watching Liverpool lose in 1971 I became a Liverpool fan forever and Steve Heighway inspired me to become a number 9 centre-forward. I watched every final in England and followed them religiously in Canada.

I love the FA Cup and its drama and always will.

How much the FA Cup means to me

You're right McNulty.

The FA is magic, and it is a national institution. It is the best and most fervently followed domestic league cup in the world.

Long live the FA Cup.

No 61 - I can't agree more! As a Southend fan, I awoke eagerly at 9.25 to see the Sunday morning highlights on ITV.... what a disappointment! I wanted to see Chelsea dominating safe in the knowledge that it would all turn out all fantastically in the end! Not a happy chappy at all!

I think the main advantage MOTD has over ITV is that they have so many more proper commentators so they can be much more flexible in what order and to what details the highlights will be shown, whereas ITV seem to guess at which will be good games, such as having extended highlights of the Hull-Newcastle game near the end because they thought it would be good but turned out to be 0-0!

I'm just glad someone else noticed this poor attempt to try and show the magic of the FA Cup.

With reference to Comment 32 from : "cheeky_nffc_we're **** and we know we are"

I find it interesting that you say that I am living embodiment of all that has gone wrong with our culture; while at the same time insulting me.

Your comment is in fact everthing that is wrong in the world today, which is a refusal to accept an alternative point of view. What chance does the world have for peace when you throw insults over a comment about a football tournament, which just happens to be different to yours.

Give me Newcastle versus Manchester United in the Premier League rather than Millwall in the FA Cup any day.

#61 and #67 - Definitly agree, I found myself bored of ITV's highlights on sunday night. Too much talking on the couch and not enough football by far.

The excitement and "magic" of the F.A. Cup definitly lives on. 5th round of the cup AND the brian clough trophy at stake at Pride Park? I'd give my right arm to be there

A lot of people have been slagging off last years final without any "big 4", saying it lacked quality, big names and spectacle. Well it may have lacked the first two but it was still a good watch far better then the defensive, negative "big 4" showdown the previous year was one of the worse I've watched. In fact if I hope for anything for this years final it wil be for a "big 4" vrs. smaller club, these tend to produce the most exciting encounters.

Of the big 4 teams sent out this year only United rested players - and tbh I think that's justified with their rather full fixture list next week, they gave their second string keepers a go but I think that's fair enough

Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal (no idea which kids are first team these days tho) and Villa all sent out strong squads, Stoke rather bizarrely seem to have been the only weakened side

I think the 'excitement' of the cup is 1) nostalgia, ie the mythical 'good old days' and 2) the formation of the premier league and increasing commercialism has placed worldwide focus on the top league, diminishing the status of the cup somewhat

however I still feel the average fan and team are still in love with the cup

oh yeah - ITVs coverage was woeful

they don't know what they're doing with the highlights, they had background noise drowning out the studio, dodgy camera work in the second round and of course, andy townsend - oh and they televise less games on terrestrial

problem is we have to watch so how do we get the message across that we wouldn't be if we had the choice? I wouldn't have wanted to miss either the liverpool or villa games just out of protest

at least with the world cup we can shame them by giving the bbc an 80% share of the same game

I must admit the Coupe de France certainly runs the FA Cup close for the title of 'best domestic cup'.

The big sides are entered early in when there are loads of small sides left, the lower team plays at home and the tie is decided on the day - no chance for the big team to have a more comfortable replay at their place.

There are always shocks, last year Marseilles lost to a fourth division side, and of course who can forget when non-league Calais reached the final in 2000.

Personally for me the FA Cup is special, every year I hope my team gets a good run together and possibly draw a league team (we nearly played Huddersfield a few seasons back), but I feel France's equivalent certainly deserves a mention.

Although there are several ways to cut the argument, as far as I can tell the hypothesis is that the FA Cup has lost its magic for all who are interested in and follow football. My view is that for many of the highly-paid foreign players, managers and owners of Premiership clubs then sadly yes, the FA Cup may not mean as much to them as it probably should. However as the comments on this blog overwhelmingly seem to prove, the majority of fans still feel passionately about this oldest and most special of all domestic cups. As a QPR fan who has not seen his side progress from the 3rd round for 7 years and yet had the joy of seeing them drawn to play Chelsea last season it means an awful lot. I can't comment on TV coverage as an expat I have to suffer the disjointed coverage of a non-footy loving broadcaster but I don't think who shows it on tv can have that much influence in how the competition as a whole is perceived. I waited for our result this weekend with much more excitement than I did our recent league results; similarly I was first on the web to check who we might get in the 4th round. Years ago I also used to watch my local non-league side battle it out in the qualifying rounds hoping they'd get a plum tie against League opposition or maybe their local rivals. I can't really explain dwindling crowds - only 8,800 watched QPR v Burnley but I'd like to think those who do go are the real fans, for whom the passion for the Cup remains. The glory boys, the bandwagoners can stay at home. For those who remember life before the Premiership, the Cup has all the magic it's always had.

The FA Cup is the 'real thing'.
There's no competition like it , the world over, that proves that on any one day, eleven men line up against eleven men, and anything can happen. It doesn't matter what each player's wage packet is. Whoever is stronger, and craftier, on the day will win. That's my vote for the earlier rounds when the magic can mean that a team of policemen, waiters and carpenters can beat the best that the football academies have spent ten years developing in classrooms and on astroturf.
As for the Final, sometimes it's a great game,
sometimes it's crap. But all us ex-pats around the world arise at un-godly hours to watch it 'live' in peculiar pubs in unexpected places, and wear our silly colors. The FA Cup is great.

A cup tournament is a cup, a league is a league

Any team can beat any other given a little luck, a lot of heart and a smattering of ability. This is the beauty of a cup competition. Until the man in black blows, you've a chance, no matter who you're drawn against

This was one of the reasons I was very pro-Platini when he ran for the presidency, he was all about taking the European Cup back to a proper cup competition. Group phases massively favour the richer teams with the bigger squads, but in a true cup competition you shouldn't be allowed to relax as you've now qualified

Is it my imagination or did clubs used to get fined for putting out understrength sides, regardless of the competition, why doesn't that happen anymore?

Love the FA cup. Exeter holding Man U. Bootiful!!

As a UK ex-pat (15 years in Brazil), there's no way you could say the FA Cup is anywhere near as close in importance as the PL. The 'English' PL is really global now whereas the FA Cup is cherished only by the English. All countries have similar competitions and the opportunities for David to kill Goliath is great entertainment locally. But no more than that. Boards of directors, managers and even players, play with the global fan$ in mind.
As a kid, I always wanted my team to win the FA Cup over the (then) League (we came a close second to Spurs in '81) but to the movers and shakers of English football and those who bring it to the masses, the money (and therefore importance) is on the PL and CL. Ask any manager which one he would rather have on his CV. Ask any fan today which trophy he would rather his team lift.
That said, the Wembley atmosphere on final day is fantastic. It's a one off and also a prelude to summer and the good feelings that go with it. FA Cup final day is a national institution, even outside of football (emphasis on 'national'). Round three attendances may be dwindling, but the attendance come May will be the highest ANY of the teams have had in any match all season. And you have to get through the round ones, twos and threes to get there.
As for talk of the big four not taking it seriously, winning BOTH PL and FA is really the only true test of a GREAT team. Liverpool may be clamouring for the PL this season and will surely gloat if they get it, but really they need to set their sights on both to truly get on their high horse and have anybody listen. In that sense, for historic glory, it is AS important. From decade to decade, people only remember teams that did the double.
And ask Arsene if he won't be taking it seriously this year. With no chance of PL, an outside chance of CL, FA silverware may just keep him in a job.
P.S. Will someone please do something about Mark Hughes.

It's that time of the year again - when a much-loved colleague advances with a tabloid in his hand jabbing a ""figure"" angrily at dwindling attendances for FA Cup third round matches.
------
DID YOU MEAN FINGURE?

There is no hiding from the fact that FA cup is devalued.

Some suggestions to help everyone take the FA Cup with the seriousness it deserves.

1. Scrap the League Cup - what is the point of having two knock out competitions? one just detracts from the other so bin the one with no history or tradition.

2. Give the winner one of the four places in the Champions League. You never know, a non-big four may still win the FA cup under this arrangement and this would provide some financial levelling in the English game when such a team participates in the CL and gets the related windfall. Might add to the interest of the CL as well, seeing a different team or two in it, from time to time.

3. Abolish semis at Wembley as that was a pathetic idea.

The FA Cup is not devalued. It is still the greatest national club competition in the world.

Declining attendances? 7,000 Barrow supporters turned up in Middlesbrough on Saturday. More than any opposing premiership side could ever muster; more than ManU (mind you, Glory Hunters don't travel); probably more than any home Barrow game.

To the vast majority of reall football supporters it is not devalued at all; it just depends on your perspective and what kind of chair you sit in when you watch a game.

I think credit where its due liverpool played a full strength team against preston, and to the fella who said last years final was boring as never had any team from top four, what about the year before, the much hyped first final at the new wembly between chelsea and man utd boring boring boring

20 years ago, winning the FA cup was second only to winning the title. Now it is far more important to a club to finish 4th in the league, and the clubs and (most) fans to their credit understand this.

Ask a villa fan. If they finish 4th this year, they have the chance to try and cement themselves as a top club, to keep their best players, and to try and build a side that can win the title. Win the FA cup and you have a trophy, but it does not help you build your club. If you dont have aspirations of ever winning the title thats fine -- but for those that do like Spurs, Villa, Everton, Newcastle --- the priority is clear.

for those already in the top 4, the FA cup is a second rate trophy. In particular Rafa would be mad to field his best XI against Everton -- Liverpool have their best chance in almost 20 years to win the title -- does he really want to risk injury to his players, as well as adding to the inevitable fixture congestion if they progress in the far more important champions league ?? Much better for liverpool if they get knocked out now, and let their players take a break while United compete on 4 fronts.

The FA cup is a great trophy - its less important than the Premiership or the Champions league but that's always been the case - liverpool hardly won it in the 70s despite dominating domestic and european football but no-one moaned then. In fact, the modern cup probably peaked in the late 80s/early 90s when english clubs were banned from european football so there were less trophies to go for.

The reason the premiership teams appear less bothered about it now is simple - cash. The rewards of staying in the premier league and/or qualifying for europe mean that they often field weakened teams in the early rounds, especially against lower division opposition.

However, as Phil says, once teams get through a couple of rounds and realise they're still in it, suddenly it takes on a different context. Liverpool fans are quite happy to use their 2006 success as proof of Rafa's managerial credentials and as a United fan it was gutting to go out to Portsmouth last year and lose to chelsea the year before. No its not as important as the Premiership - but it never has been...

I read up to ElectricHeron's comments and just got incensed! Sad existence? Nah mate, far from it. Even on our current poor form we're loving here - every minute of it. It shows with our attendances, atmosphere, everything about the club.

Your right, every club should go for it in every competition there in. Its the chance to grab some silverware - I couldn't agree more. That's why we went for it in the League Cup. We got to the quarters and the feeling about the place that we have a genuine shot at the semi's of a cup was brilliant and put in a shocking performance against Derby, and deserved to lose (even though it was a dubious penalty in the final minute). I personally was gutted we hadn't taken what was a great opportunity to get to the semi finals of a major competition.

As for the FA Cup this weekend; this journo makes it sound as though we dropped the whole first 11. To be honest, our team was pretty much the strongest we could have fielded (worrying I know that we still couldn't beat Hartlepool with all due respect). It wasn't as if we deliberately put out a weakened side. Anyway, we stokies don't expect decent research from the journo's anywhere. We basically put in a woeful performance and Hartlepool deserved to win.

Oh the sooner these debates about the FA cup losing its magic/being devalued etc, stop, the better. They are getting a bit tedious. They have popped up consistently for the last few years around this time.

"At the other end of the scale Histon, Torquay, Kettering and Blyth will bring that wonderful element of the unknown to the next stage of the FA Cup."

Err as far as I'm aware Blyth have to beat Blackburn tonight first before bringing said element to the next stage

What a sad, miserable, pointless existence that is. Instead of actually going full throttle for a cup run and possible victory, which will ensure glory and memories.

There are teams who just make up the numbers, but passionately.

Leeds tried to compete and look what happened. They went bankrupt and are now in what league?

The cup is a great leveler, unless you're talking about Yeovil's pitch.

Let the big 4 and the relegation fighting teams put out weaker teams, it gives the others a chance. Let's just see the players competing. There's nothing better than a competitive match, no matter who is playing.

Go Blyth, play with heart, anything can is possible if you believe.

Those who say the big 4 don't take it seriously, just look at the winners and finalists since the Premiership started in 92. Only Portsmouth last year and Everton (95) have won it outside of the big 4. But if you look at winners going back before then, they were much more often outside the top 4 teams. Liverpool in the 70s and 80s were notoriously poor in the cup when winning all their league titles.

So to say the big teams don't take it seriously is a bit of a myth.

There's also a myth that the Premiership is so much stronger than the rest of the league. Last season, IIRC, 9 teams went out in the 3rd round, and 3 of the 4 semi-finalists were Championship sides. Even in the depths of non-league football the quality and professionalism has improved a lot.

Re #13.

For Liverpool's 3rd rd game via Preston, Rafa picked a really strong 11, with only the goalkeeper and Babel coming in. This is the first 3rd match Gerrard and Carragher have played in for 2/3 years now (if my memory serves me correct).

I personally think Rafa now knows how important this trophy is, and if you think he's going to field a poor team against the blue half of the city, then you need to wake up.

I love the FA cup, it's as good as football gets. Gillingham were brilliant against Villa, and lived up to the classic underdog status. Loved it.

Long live the FA Cup.

As a Blyth Spartans fan my interest usually ends when we get knocked out in the qualifying rounds.

The only real difference this year is that we have progressed a lot futher than we usually do.

For clubs at our level there still is a certain amount of magic involved with the FA Cup - but only if you draw a League team.

I feel that most Premiership teams do not care about the Cup.

The best moment of my football career was scoring a winning goal in the FA Cup extra preliminary round 4 or 5 years ago. I sprinted forward from my left full back position to slide in at the back post and toe poke a late winner for my team.

That for me is the magic of the cup that nobody can ever take away. Even a useless nobody of a player like I was can have their moment in August and know that they have played their own part in the competition when they see the famous old trophy lifted aloft at Wembley in May.

It's the greatest club knock out competition in the world and the "johnny come latelys" can keep their overblown advertising hoarding that is the Champions League .

Give me a choice as an Arsenal fan - what would I take in May? I am no doubt in the minority, but I'd take the FA Cup. Everytime.

Why do have to have this pointless debate every year? It's just the same with the GCSE results!

Yawn.

i hate all the hype about the fa-cup. whoever owns the rights to show it in any given year (bbc, itv, sentanta etc) always spew out the same old cliches about "dreams", "upsets", "fairytales", "romance". its all crap, ask any true fan and they will say their teams priority is promotion or to stay in the division they are on (west brom, stoke etc). the only people who take the fa cup as a #1 priority are people over the age of 50 and footy-firms who like the chance of an old fashioned "meet & beat up".

as roy keane once said when asked (probably by motty) "what does the fa-cup mean to you roy?" he answered, along the lines of "its just a cup and if you get to the final an nice day out, but we at man utd want to be winning the league and champions league".

longhornman :-) (comments 26 & 68)

the beauty of democracy is that 'everyone is entitled to their opinion' however, when peoples opinions are utter tosh you begin to see its failings.

tell me, do you religiously watch x-factor and strictly come dancing? after all, this is what the media tells you to do isn't it? girls aloud fan per chance?

i don't believe for a second that in your heart of hearts you derive pleasure from watching a dour game between newcastle and wigan and that the quest to move up from 14th to 13th for the prize of a million quid more. whats the point? newcastle will only waste it anyway?

thats all the premiership is for most teams in it, jockeying for prize money in a mind numbing rigmarole of average football, best league in the world my ****!

who have you drawn in the 4th round? deal with hull in the replay and the opponents in round 4 and your beginning to smell wembley, you'll be interested in the cup then won't you?

The fact you came-up with the headline, in itself, suggests that it has. The fact you refer to the anominous colleague's view says it has.

The many responses say it has.

#53, in trying to make a case for the FA Cup says:

"There are those who state that the Prem and CL are priorities. It wasn?t always the case."

Makes the case himself that the Cup has lost some of its magic.

And finally, you yourself state:

"Remember how the big names such as Liverpool, Chelsea and Manchester United dropped like flies to open up last year's tournament?"

Yes, and that says it all about priority and its "magic".

20 years ago this article would never have ocurred to anyone.

Everything above categorically confirms that the FA Cup is not what it used to be.

As an Evertonian I cannot wait for the fourth round. Yes, we may well get knocked out by our bitter rivals, but that isn't the point: the expectation is enormous and anyone who doubts cup fever truly exists should just hang out in Liverpool for that week: there will be more expectation (and a better atmosphere) at the cup game than the league match.

A couple of points on the "romance" of the cup: 1. a massive problem is the importance of finishing in the top 4 and also the money associated with Premier league positions. It's perfectly acceptable for a manager / player to say they want to win the league than the cup, but to come 4th? For me I would genuinely rather Everton won the cup than finished 4th, even if this did mean less money and less long term stability. Unfortunately the likes of Martin O'Neill probably think otherwise.

2. Increased TV exposure of the Premiership is another problem. Don't get me wrong: I love the fact that the Premiership is shown live every week - it supplements going to the game brilliantly. But back in the day there was so little football on telly that the FA Cup became the one place that everyone (season ticket holders or casual fans alike) could be an armchair fan, supporting a minnow for a weekend. That spectacle has been lost forever and is never coming back.