Thursday 29 April 2010

an hour long programme? How will you cope? The debate...Liverpool p-laying Juve...will there be anyone awake?

Gordon thought he understood the concerns of the public over immigration levels but I don't think he cuts it and I don't think he knows that he does not cut it.

In my view the same applies to the economy as he is a busted flush who came lately to admitting that "there should have been more regulation" and that remains a long way short from saying he contributed to the disaster and let the country down.

We will be paying for this for about 10-15 years I understand.

As the media have said none of the parties have covered themselves in glory in terms of showing where the pain would come in cuts (though only the Labour-New labour coalition have the books) but also there has not been enough in identifying how you stop all of this happening again in terms of regulation, accountancy and fraud laws.

If the allegations prove to be true nobody can afford Fabulous Fab's to be let loose on the block again.

'King: Election winner will be out of power for a generation'

https://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/edmundconway/100005270/king-election-winner-will-be-out-of-power-for-a-generation/

On the banks it was said some time back that Mexico was now about the same size in the finance sector as the UK - though they have other irons in the fire.

I am sure that the Mexican banks are required to be internationally approved.

But it occurs to me that if they have vast amounts of drugs cash slopping around in Mexico due to the cartels then some may have liquidity and that must be attractive.

It must also stand out like a sore thumb so I have wondered many times in the past as to whether it is easier today to home in on money laundering and whether there is a greater chance to impact the drugs trade.

Brown will I assume try to play up his role in the aftermath of the economic crisis with the international meetings.

He will try to play down his role in light touch regulation that helped create the problem.

The public though are understandably fickle and I don't think they will care whether the IMF said this or said that because none of them saw the crash coming in the first place.

So I think he will get less credit than he expects.

I also think that he is prone to emotional outbursts and that this is the occasion when he may lose it with the pressure that some trends suggest Labour could come in with circa 26% in my world - below the Michael Foot levels.

I expect Clegg to do OK again and that Cameron will fail to deliver a knock out blow to either of his opponents and will end up looking like a miffed little Lord Fauntleroy.

If the BNP are to offer people who are not white £50,000 to leave could the idea not be adapted by other parties.

If they offer £50,000 we will offer 60,000 .... £70,000 for the BNP to leave.

It may not happen but doesn't it make you smile a little?

#66

Singie

Should I worry about my health more on the left , the right or the rear side of my body? I do experience some physical symptoms that seem to swing insanely between the three. I wonder whether it's anything to do with the city pressure. Was that a hint about the inner ear entertaiment?

It looks like brossen99 would be keen on the land of plenty. Rising above the personal, eh, but not physical?

How much are you hoping for for your 'services'?

while he was doing all his sweetheart deals with the bankers, lite regulation and all that, storing up mayhem for years and the tab to be picked by all of us...the plebs so anything that can embarrass this prime minister is OK by me, the problem being that if the Brown ship implodes we have a nightmare scenario to face as smiler boy Dave can inflict any type of hardship in the name of fiscal proberty...what a choice...no choice...

Lib Dem warns of 'power of Jewish lobby'

the economy? Another repost from me, i'm afraid.

"NNWebTeam weds 28/4/10 #63:

"Given that development, HMG were remiss in not following the same tack, apparently due to ridiculously low estimates of migrating numbers, supplied by - who knows? - a low profile civil servant, perhaps?"

a great illustrator of events are the 'minority opinions' expressed at the time. There was a mentioned 'minority report' at the time of EU expansion, that warned of the effects of unlimited migration from those countries to the UK! It warned that the influx, UNLESS extra resources were put into already disadvantaged areas, those areas would suffer from social shortages, and cause *massive* social reaction.

they knew this, because most migrant labour seeks to find the cheapest accommodation available - as someone who has working-travelled before, i know this to be the case, and so did all of those well-paid middle-upper class 'wipes who drew up the legislation. So suddenly the poorest areas had greater strains on their resources - and as we all know, the NuLabour Govt did bugger all, the Tories smugly looked the other way, and Clegg's LibDems carried on with their program to look like the Tories.

why??

what have the owners and funders of the Big 3£ parties got to gain from a growth in openly racist, fascist response from the working and underclasses?

why would the Big 3£ prefer rage against poor, hard working immigrants, rather than more justified rage against the ultra-wealthy, the Bankers, Owners, Media Barons, 'Captains of Industry' and all their tax-avoiding ilk?

...or it could all big a big accident, caused by ill thought-out policies, and plain incompetence by those who have resided in Westminster as MPs, maxing their claims and bonuses, ordering our Soldiers to die for American aims, deregulating the Banks, cutting taxes on the ludicrously wealthy, allowing British Industry to go bankrupt or stolen by foreign companies, watching as the British Social Fabric rents and tears due to an enormous and growing Wealth Gap. It could be.

that some have been involved in the core of these decisions, who have a good grasp of the 1930s however (not least Rupert Murdoch), and desire the insanity of a Fascist State that gives them 'Absolute Power' (lol), can surely only be denied by those lost in the Glamour and Narcissism of Presidential Debates for a Prime Ministerial system.

the Leadership of the Tories, of NuLabour, of the LibDems are ALL corrupt, and either grossly incompetent or else criminally competent. The BNP is an MI5 puppet show, to give the poorest and angriest a feeling *their* wishes can be heard - and to raise anger against "non-British". The BNP has no ideas of how to rebuild Britain, and create British Jobs - except in paramilitary house-to-house checks, enforced ID Cards, and further extending the Surveillance Society. UKIP blame ALL our troubles on the Europeans, Johnny Foreigner yet again. Little mention of how we British will slash this Wealth-Gap - but lots of talk about how they will slash Social Payments to the poorest and neediest. £50Bn is a LOT of hospitals, schools and police, let alone roads, refuse recycling and libraries.

it is only the Greens who have a comprehensive plan to get out of the mess, it is only the Greens who have accurately analysed what got us into this mess (the Wealth Gap, and a Ruling Class in permanent power due to an ancient voting system), it is only the Greens who are honest about investing in Britain to create new industries, new jobs, and pay back the debt through economic growth.

all the other parties are blaming Foreigners - only the Greens recognise the problems are home-grown (like MPs-Expenses-'Gate'), and the solutions are ALSO home-grown.

so WHY did the NuLabour/Tory Govt allow in immigrants without also putting the extra resources in? Because that creates the kind of social-angst, that the Parties of the Rich can use to focus anger from the British Poorest onto largely weak and helpless immigrants, who have no way of defending themselves. Unlike, it almost needs no saying after the rest of this post, Britain's Uber-Wealthy.

"And why don't indigenes take these jobs the Eastern Europeans get?
Is the minimum wage too low, are benefits too high; are the British in the main poorly trained?"

Thatcher openly boasted that she was turning the UK into a "low-wage, high profit" economy, the problem with that is that we normal citizens *don't* believe that our poorest should be living in absolute squalor and degradation, and that even children of the poorest should have a decent start in their lives. The benefits are already FAR behind the rate of Inflation, and have been for 30yrs or more since the Thatcherites came to power. The wealth of the richest has gone astronomical. Minimum wage is a terrible joke, Gawd forbid that companies should have to pay enough for their workers to live on, when the Owners can add another Billion to their bank accounts. The effective minimum wage in Denmark is over £11/hour - AND they have a lot of local cooperatives/capitalist partnerships. The Danes also invest 2-3 TIMES what we spend per capita on Education.

so, training, benefits? Low wages? Corruption at the top i would say. And none of the Big 3£ are honest about wanting to change that - after all, they HAVEN'T SO FAR!!

express your *anger* - Vote Green."

-------

i expect tonight the Great Fuhrers will make much noise about investment in jobs, and cutting spending - ie they will cut essential public service jobs, and hand more £Bns to their friendly Multi-nats. They have no intention of rebuilding the UK, no intention of working hard for normal people, no intention of anything except to get elected so they can continue the plunder. All 3£ are revolting individuals, who are merely practising their lying skills upon us, preparing for Power when they can completely ignore us again, and drive the UK even further into the cesspit they have collectively put us in.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

it's the economy, stupid;

An old boss of mine always used to say; "learn from the past, live in the present and strategize for the future."

Sometimes I get the distinct impression that not only politicians but also media people think we all came up the Mersey on a bike!

Public spending; 704 billion; receipts; 546 billion = deficit c160billion.

Objective; halve the deficit (irrelevant whether "structural" or "cyclical") in 4 years= 8obillion over 4= 20billion p.a. to save.

Currently the argument is about 6billion in NICS; so there's much more to talk about tonight in terms of strategy i.e. HOW to reduce the deficit by half over the lifetime of the next parliament.

Given the way the vultures are feeding on Greece and now circling Portugal and Spain, next week's new HMG need to set about strategizing pronto. And only then will we know the true extent of the task ahead.

Tonight's debate? Gordi will self destruct, Clegg will continue to shine and Lord Snooty has to do better; but will he, or will Cleggie's chums do the job for him next week?

Mandelson's Cheshire cat impersonation is working to its logical conclusion; next Friday, all that will remain will be the smile.

#5:
"I expect Clegg to do OK again and that Cameron will fail to deliver a knock out blow to either of his opponents and will end up looking like a miffed little Lord Fauntleroy."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EucJIl0uonE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SeLSNzEorbI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tWSr1Aw0EBA&feature=PlayList&p=D2CB8636394DB32D&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=43

;)

THE COST OF 'LOW LEVEL' MENTAL HEALTH 'ISSUES'.

In tonight's debate - and in political discussion generally - you will hear nothing of the increasing mental stress and distress in this country. It is growing, yet the cost in human misery, and consequential monetary terms, is ignored. The only 'mental health' addressed is regarding those who have a chronic condition, hence fall into the 'disabled' arena.

The bizarre truth, as already posted - and illustrated by Brown's struggle with himself, is that Westminster is peopled by the psychologically challenged, engaging in compensatory activity. Put simply, they 'feel small', so 'aspire big'. (Perhaps that should be the slogan to trump them all?)

These are not just turkeys, they are M & S (Muddle and Squander) turkeys. They are not hired for ability, but for allegiance; not promoted for integrity but for deviousness. Westminster is NEVER GOING TO manage the tangible aspects of state, with skill, LET ALONE IMPROVE THE MENTAL HEALTH OF THE NATION. Yet that is where CONTENTMENT, leading to a reduction in all the negative aspects of community behaviour, arises.

Barmy Britain will not be mentioned. Barmy Britain self medicates, largely with alcohol. It is the primary trigger for a vast amount of crime - WITH ITS WASTE AND COST (not to mention further stress to those already struggling).

We can discuss money and mechanisms till the cows starve, but until we learn (re-learn?) to acknowledge the emotional needs of the population, all the monetary stability in the world, will only buy mass medication and, eventually asylums. Time to consider: WHAT WOULD NATURE DO?

Spending £100bn on Trident certainly isn't going to help with any economic recovery, we’ll still be paying for it in 30 years time. Could help help Clegg if the subject comes up again tonight

WHY ARE THE VANGUARD SUCCESSOR CLASS (TRIDENT) SUBMARINES NEEDED??

ANSWER:

"Argentina gets first Russian defense deal", 26_04-2010:

https://www.upi.com/Business_News/Security-Industry/2010/04/26/Argentina-gets-first-Russian-defense-deal/UPI-64361272276060/

"The deal also comes amid designs by Russia and Argentina to bolster relations in nuclear power development...

"... and share use of the Russian Global Navigation Satellite System (GLONASS).

(in case the US ever cuts off Argentina access to the GPS system?????)

"Argentina has two nuclear power plants in service. A third is under construction, while Argentine President Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner has said a fourth was under consideration but there was no indication of the project's estimated cost.

"... Argentina generates about 20 percent of its electricity by using Russian-made equipment, Russian Economy Ministry says.

"ARGENTINA ABANDONED A NUCLEAR WEAPONS PROGRAM DURING THE 1990's.... (my emphasis- rvl.

( Can the UK's politicians say with certainty that ARGENTINA's NUCLEAR WEAPONS PROGRAMME WILL NEVER BE RE-STARTED????)

"Kirchner stressed there was no intention of returning to militarization and that the deal opted to help Buenos Aires develop its civilian nuclear energy program....

"Related agreements were also signed between Argentina and Russia for cooperation in the field of railway transportation...."

"Medvedev's visit to Argentina: more than 10 agreements signed ", 15_04-2010:

https://en.rian.ru/world/20100415/158586719.html

https://www.deagel.com/news/Argentina-and-Russia-Sign-Nuclear-Power-Generation-and-GLONASS-Agreements-and-Sale-of-Two-Mi-171E-Helicopters_n000007291.aspx
========================

https://www.janes.com/articles/Janes-Defence-Weekly-2010/Concealed-carriage-Club-K-changes-cruise-missile-rules.html :

"Russia's Novator Experimental Design Bureau has developed a containerized version of its Club family of anti-ship and land-attack cruise missiles.

"...The new variant, the Club-K Container Missile System (CMS), is perhaps the ultimate concealed weapon as the entire system is housed, transported and fired using a standard 40 ft shipping container.

"Such a container, referred to in the shipping industry as a 'forty-foot equivalent unit' (FEU), provides a completely anonymous means to move and deploy the Club-K system.

"Novator's parent company, Concern Morinformsystema-AGAT, highlights the system's ability to be launched from land or sea by non-military platforms, with no obvious sign of the weapon's presence until it is fired..."

"Deadly new Russian weapon hides in shipping container", 26_04-2010:

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE63P2XB20100426

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/7632543/A-cruise-missile-in-a-shipping-box-on-sale-to-rogue-bidders.html

https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/cruise-missile-defense-hits-the-usas-political-radar-screen-04243/

"The Cruise Missile Challenge: Designing a Defense Against Asymmetric Threats", May-2007:

(The above reference document is a "PDF" format document. Since the censors at the BBC's Newsnight don't allow links to ubiquitous-across-the-Internet PDF format documents, below I have removed the .pdf from the end of the link address...

Persons who wish to view this reference document ought to run a search using the title "The Cruise Missile Challenge: Designing a Defense Against Asymmetric Threats"...

[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]

For Newsnight to promote itself as an investigative programme, but to simultaneously implement policies that block readers of its web site from being able to access factual background documents that are relevant to topics that Newsnight is reporting- and the public are discussing- is ludicrous...
==============================

With the extended and extending) ranges of some of Novator's ASCM's (such as the SS-N-27)- and extrapolating from Janes' reporting that they are loadable into and fire-able from the aggressively widely marketed converted shipping container missile launchers, and with railroad tracks and truck-traversing-roads typically paralleling, or generally following/regularly going very-near most countries' coast lines, it seems that countries with blue water navies- such as the UK- that have reversed plans to provide their new surface combatants- such as the Type-45 Destroyers- with "Advanced Gun Systems" (AGS's) that are compatible with "Long Range Land Attack Projectile" (LRLAPs) and "Extended Range Guided Munitions" (ERGMs) ought to be rethinking their XX!!**X*XX!! decision....

https://www.baesystems.com/ProductsServices/l_and_a_as_advanced_gun_system.html

How many hostile/potentially hostile countries with traversable shorelines and near-coast areas would not have roads and railroad tracks running close to their shores &/or through their near-shore areas??

Shores and near-shore areas of hostile, friendly, and neutral countries could become locations for state and non-state actors to position 'converted shipping container' Novator systems on a permanent or transient irregular basis...

The 13-14 mile maximum range standard-technology shells fired from Type-45's (chosen for cheapness) out-of-date technology Deck Gun compare badly to the 60-mile on up to over 100-mile ranges of the BAE Advanced Gun System (AGS) and "Long Range Land Attack Projectile" "Extended-Range Guided Munition" shells originally identified for fitting to Type-45's...

Apparently, the much cheaper low tech Deck Gun that has ended up being fitted to Type-45's instead of the AGS was chosen due to Treasury budget pressures of the 2004-2005 period....

=========================

"Falklands' war tested modernized Super Etendard in Argentine Navy's agenda", 21_02-2010:

https://en.mercopress.com/2010/02/21/falklands-war-tested-modernized-super-etendard-in-argentine-navy-s-agenda

"... The possible transfer to Argentina of a refurbished model of the French manufactured fighter-bomber Super Etendard, which had an outstanding performance during the 1982 Falkland Islands conflict, is under consideration by the French Ministry of Defence..."
=========================

IS A COMPETENTLY EQUIPPED, 'BLUE WATER' ROYAL NAVY LIKELY TO BE NEEDED BY THE UK (AND ITS ALLIES) IN THE FUTURE??

Future basis for nation-to-nation conflicts and the UK's strategic Interests in the coming century:

1) During the coming decades is it absolutely impossible that a South American country will develop nuclear weapons??

2) Do Central & South America's countries' two centuries of revolving door, very often abusive-to-human rights dictatorships, exportation of illicit narcotics & erratic- often hugely destabilizing- foreign policies bode well for countries in other parts of the world during the coming decades?

3) Is there evidence that Central & South America's countries' well established propensities for: military dictatorships; excessive involvement of their militaries in governmental & justice system structures; civil service corruption; dysfunctional legal systems; AND mal-governance generally...

... will change in a positive direction- PERMANENTLY- during the coming decades?

If the answer is 'no' to any of the above, then countries with pivotal, central, constructive roles on the world stage- such as the United Kingdom- that in the coming decades wish to deter a South American country &/or defend themselves from it- will be grievously disadvantaged without robust, irrefutably capable & HIGHLY VISIBLE 'global reach' militaries...

==================

Add the Russia trade agreements with Argentina of the last 2-weeks to requests by Argentina to France from late February-2010 for the sale of advanced-capabilities fighter aircraft (currently being considered by France) and what does this demand from the UK- total ignorance and the continued gutting and weakening of the RN- or prudent upgrading of RN capabilities??

Any country- such as the UK- with a better-part-of-2-centuries long history occupying leading positions on the world's most powerful and influential political, legal, trade, financial and military bodies needs to be seen to be structuring its military capabilities and high-tech/industrial competencies as though it intends to retain these positions...

If the UK builds- or becomes known to be intending to build- during a 2-decade span- less than half the operationally-required numbers of an integral to national defence & 'world roles' class of surface combatant- and the ones it does build are dangerously stripped-down and bereft of industry-standard weapons, communications and defensive systems- as is the case with the new Type-45 Destroyers and planned aircraft carriers-

and

if the UK builds- or becomes known to be intending to build- during a 2-decade span- less than half the operationally-required numbers of an integral to national defence & 'world roles' class of sub-surface combatant- or cancels the building of these vessels entirely:

... the UK can expect to be viewed by other countries as weak and ambitionless- possessing misguided and incompetent leadership, and not worthy of retaining its long-held positions of leadership on the world's most powerful and influential political, legal, trade, financial and military bodies...


_________________
Roderick V. Louis,
Vancouver, BC, Canada

not on-topic for tonight, but just to mention: this "recalling of MPs" idea has a couple of major flaws.

first of all, with such concentration of media in so few hands, it is fairly easy for the media barons to whip up a campaign and unseat someone. It would only work alongside limits on media ownership.

secondly, if, as apparently most Britons want, we end up with a multi-member constituency, weak party list PR electoral system, we would have to elect ALL the constituency MPs again. That is not a killer however.

thirdly, i cannot help but wonder why the Big 3£ are not ALSO writing legislation that would allow the Public to recall the ENTIRE Parliament!?

it would be simple to pass legislation that upon an amount of petition signatures, (60% of the electorate perhaps?), the Govt is FORCED to initiate within 2 weeks a clear referendum on holding a new General Election ASAP.

wonder why they're not trumpeting THAT idea to get rid of corrupt and incompetent MPs, surely they don't imagine they're going to be incredibly unpopular AFTER the election, after all they are being so "honest and direct" with us now.

rofl. :(

editted post #11:

"6. At 1:43pm on 29 Apr 2010, thegangofone wrote:

If the BNP are to offer people who are not white £50,000 to leave could the idea not be adapted by other parties.

If they offer £50,000 we will offer 60,000 .... £70,000 for the BNP to leave.

It may not happen but doesn't it make you smile a little?"

actually, imagine a scenario, far too good an outcome to be realistic - unfortunately.

due in part to global sanctions on selling arms to them, Israel realises its current policy towards their neighbours 'isn't working'. They pull back to the UN Green Zone, negotiate for the illegal settlements. They then pump money in to rebuild Palestine, setting up cooperatives, and opening access to higher education etc, just like a normal country does to its neighbours. THEN, and only THEN, by offering UK Palestinian residents £50,000 to go back, each person returning can set up a new company on cooperative lines, to rebuild their Nation on their ancient lands. The £50,000 would be an incentive not to leave, but to build a better future for them and their People, and (if not done by the BNP but a Govt actually concerned about Peace and a safer future), there is the good chance the new companies will be looking to trade with the UK, to the benefit of us both. It would be a win-win.

of course, the BNP are just doing it to claim that 'The only Good Briton is a White Briton', because they are scaremongering, racist imbeciles, but given some changes in Western Behaviour, such ideas may have good roots.

---by the by, imagine the UK also goes against American wishes, and starts to rebuild Iraq and Afghanistan on the same, Qoran-friendly local cooperative terms, many of those waiting in Calais would probably prefer to go back home and rebuild, rather than come here to a Society and Economy that is in tatters, deliberately run into the ground by our corrupt Elite. In some ways, i can understand WHY Afghans want to come here - its so similar to their own country!

luckily for us however, WE don't have US soldiers making sure we vote in the 'right' way - we just see American Multi-nats throwing money and expertise into getting the Big 3£ elected.


by-the-by, the same policies, building cooperatives, investing in new companies and jobs for the UK, is being pushed by WHICH minor Party, and is the only Party to have maintained that stance not because of professional pollster advice, but because they actually are honest and intend to achieve it? And are NOT getting millions from tax-havens and multi-nationals for their Election Campaigns?

--i dunno. Maybe they'll be in this 'Leadership Debate' tonight? Not holding my breath on that though.



--no swearing or electioneering in this post, see? ^_^

editted post #12:

#3:

"The Institute for Fiscal Studies spelt it out earlier this week in typically frank terms. Labour and the LibDem plans imply the biggest squeeze on public services since the 1970s, when the IMF was in town. The Tory plans imply the biggest set of cuts since records began in 1948."


so there we have it - the destruction of the Welfare State, a Thatcherite dream since 1979. Caused by deregulation of the Banks, by Thatcherite Govts.

synchronous? Or just accidental luck for our Rulers? I leave it to you to decide.


Peace and Love, :wub:

WHAT PART OF LABOUR'S HIGH-SPEED RAIL PROPOSAL WILL LEAD TO, IS INTENDED TO LEAD TO OR IS LIKELY TO LEAD TO HIGH-SPEED RAIL/PUBLIC-TRANSPORT RELATED PRODUCTS AND SERVICES THAT CAN BE EXPORTED??

With the many billions upon billions of pounds proposed for allocation towards new high-speed rail line(s) and as UK economic stimulus by the current govt, why couldn't some of this money be put towards the establishment of a "rail and public transport R & D technology centre/research campus" in the UK... if necessary with the UK govt as a temporary shareholder in the venture??

Such a centre/campus comprising significant representation from a world-class rail technology leader such as Hitachi, along with a top-drawer UK firm that has cutting-edge complimentary technology expertise, such as Rolls-Royce, would be one way of providing the new centre/campus with automatic positive world-recognition...

Properly done, upgrading the United Kingdom's rail & people/goods transport-related infrastructure could lead to new UK industrial competencies: in areas of high-speed trains, track, undersea tunnels, clean-technology buses/lorries & related technologies...

Making the UK- including ALL ITS COMPONENTS, IE: Scotland, Wales & N Ireland- the best rail-networked country within the EU ought to be an unequivocally delineated policy of whatever party is in govt.

Linking the UK mainland with N Ireland via an (in need of building) undersea high-speed rail tunnel or 2 is long overdue!!

Improving the movement of goods & people both within the UK & to/from other EU countries could only benefit UK trade as well as strengthening the binding of Scotland (& Wales) into the Union...

But if new high-speed rail lines in the UK do little more than this, while providing massive 'UK tax-payer subsidized' advertisements for France's TGV high-speed rail system- and the UK continues to be without its own exportable rail technologies, who will reap the majority of benefits of new high-speed rail lines in the UK- UK tax-payers or France's??

Utilizing France's technologies for UK transport is not bad per say, but is the UK govt effectively handing France (and likely Germany through its Siemens' high-speed rail products) carte blanche monopolies of the types of high-speed rail products and technologies that are deployed in the UK for the next 1/2 to 3/4 of a century politically or economically wise??

Why is there such little focus on the enormous opportunities for the UK to develop EXPORTABLE high-speed rail and public transport products and technologies?- perhaps working with countries that would like assistance getting their high-speed rail companies better positioned to compete against France's TGV and Germany's Siemens??

As part of whatever party forms govt's long-term economic plans & dealing with the current economic difficulties, competent UK companies with rail-transport equipment related technological expertise ought to be enabled to innovate & diversify & if practical- to set up joint ventures with &/or acquire complementary overseas firms...

Rolls-Royce is a good example...

Rolls could be a leader in many fields other than jet engines & turbines.

Japan's Hitachi, Toshiba & other companies that produce leading-edge technology high-speed train systems->> that could be made compatible with those in EU countries; nuclear reactors & the like & that want a greater presence in western markets could be brought into alliances with- or might allow (parts of) themselves to be bought by Rolls- but not without considerable UK govt funding & negotiating efforts applied to these objectives.

A highly capable UK company such as a Rolls-Royce, GKN or VT paired with an industry-peer like 1 of Japan's high-speed train manufacturers, could use their joint & complementary expertise to co-develop & market designs that would be legitimate world beaters: competitors to France & Germany's established part-state-owned/tax-payer-subsidized companies...

A little state aligning of corporate relationships is needed...

Rolls-Royce partnered with a high-speed train manufacturer such as Hitachi could- using Rolls' internationally esteemed & invaluable 'brand' along with its extensive high technology & power generation expertise- become a legitimate world-class high-speed train competitor.

... entering a market that can only expand substantially & reliably for the long-term... both in EU member nations & developing countries like Brazil, India, China,& in East Asia.

In a similar transport-industry-related theme, Rolls partnering with companies that specialize in bus & or mass-transit technologies to produce reliable, high-quality Rolls-Royce buses &/or other types of people-movers could only become an internationally competitive player...

Canada's Westport Innovations:

www.westport.com/

produces kit that converts diesel fueled engines into (natural) gas driven types...

Westport partnered with a prestigious, highly capable company like Rolls-Royce in the production of 'clean' gas-powered (diesel-design) engines could only make inroads to bus & similar types of vehicles... which are a 'coming market'... in both the EU & developing world countries...

While state intervention into industry is usually undesirable, the state setting or assisting in establishing a general corporate or specific industry direction can have positive outcomes...

If one takes a look at France or Germany & their very well known nuclear-power companies & other successful banking, energy, software, automobiles & high-speed-train manufacturing 'state-assisted' firms... it is undeniable that state-involvement- at least in the areas of indigenous-industry direction-setting and facilitating the mergers/amalgamation of comparatively small firms into big/mega-firms capable of competing globally- has had positive outcomes...

With sufficient funding & a little creative govt negotiation assistance, UK companies such as Roll-Royce, GKN, VT and others could be producing world-beating high-speed trains; nuclear power plants & environmentally friendly public transport systems, such as gas-powered buses...

The massive borrowing now planned by Labour over the next decade ought to be put to more than just financing UK residents to 'shop till they drop', while govt relies on lazez fare economics to fix UK plc....

A long-term UK industrial & economic development strategy needs to be clearly laid out before any increases in borrowing occur...

Thinking big!! by politicians & bureaucrats is needed!!

High speed and high technology rail for the United Kingdom ought to be accompanied by the establishment of a liberally funded multi-national-membership 'world centre for rail-transport research and development facility'... with the primary objective: developing exportable rail transportation products...

While a low tax, light regulation industry environment should be an optimal objective for whatever party forms govt- there is no reason why- working with industry sector leaders- govt/state 'direction setting' could not compliment this...


Roderick V. Louis,
Vancouver, BC,
Canada

WHAT WILL THE MAIN POLITICAL PARTIES DO TO ENABLE A VIABLE UK EXPORT SECTOR??

The Labour party have said 'how they would not increase taxes' and 'where they would spend public monies'- but virtually nothing is said by Labour regarding strategies that they would action in order to maintain and enhance the competitiveness of existing UK and UK-based industries and to create new, profitable UK economic sectors and wealth generating companies...

Even less has been said- if that's possible- regarding what Labour would do in order to create jobs and to enable existing UK and UK-based firms to produce goods and provide services that can be successfully marketed overseas- in order to pay for the public services that are at risk: due to the UK's Labour-govt caused budget deficit...
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Through their half-baked, incompetent devolution programme, Labour has wrecked the UK's constitution... and imperilled the country...

To suggest that they would be a party capable of facilitating workable- let alone constructive- UK constitutional reform is laughable...
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UK ECONOMY STRIPPED OUT OF INDIGENOUS FIRMS UNDER LABOUR

Rover, British Energy, Rolls-Royce motor cars, Cadbury and a gigantic raft of high tech and defence related UK companies were bought out by foreign firms during the last 13-years of Labour party engineered 'bad luck'!!

Rather than acting to enable a level playing field for existing, successful UK industry sectors and indiginous UK research and development capabilities and put obstacles in the way of takeovers by partially-state owned and/or controlled overseas' firms- Labour did nothing...

It ought to be remembered that in 2006- under heavy pressure from a UK govt wanting to generate a few quick pounds for application to public services- and against its Board of directors and Senior Management's recommendations- British Nuclear Fuels was forced to sell its Westinghouse nuclear power unit to Toshiba of Japan...

https://www.bnfl.com/content.php?pageID=69&newsID=248

Westinghouse was and still is one of the world's biggest, most technologically capable and successful nuclear power and energy companies... set to reap many billions of pounds in profits over the next 2 decades from burgeoning nuclear power contracts in China, India, the United States, Continental Europe and elsewhere...

Several years later, the UK's British Energy is sold to France's part state owned EDF, which promptly gains approval from the UK Labour govt for rights to facilitate the building of and operating many nuclear power plants across the UK...

Plants that Toshiba's Westinghouse will play a lead role in building...

[Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]

(add .pdf to above incomplete link. BBC Newsnight's censors don't like links to PDF documents on Newsnight pages)
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The Labour party's claims that they would facilitate open, transparent govt are absurd when contrasted against their unsavory and hugely improper efforts during the last Parliament to block the release of MP's expense claims details:

Even the (Labour party) Speaker of the Commons worked against the release of MP's expense claims details- despite his position demanding strict impartiality...
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The Labour party have sold the UK out for petty short term interests:

wrecked the economy and its military; trashed its impeccable reputation by under-resourcing & bungling the Iraq & Afghanistan operations; devastated its Defence high-tech ship-building industries AND destroyed its constitution...




_________________
Roderick V. Louis

BBC's FUNDING OUGHT TO BE INCREASED!!

ALL MAJOR UK POLITICAL PARTIES OUGHT TO BE DELIBERATING HOW THE BBC's FUNDING CAN BE INCREASED OVER THE LONG TERM: UNTILL THE RAPIDLY EVOLVING HIGH TECH/NEWS, ENTERTAINMENT, BUSINESS & HUMAN-INTEREST MEDIA-DELIVERY INDUSTRY STABILIZES, THE BBC CAN'T BE TOO BIG!!

If the United Kingdom wants to remain a noticeable country on the world stage, let alone 1 that other countries' businesses/people want to do business with- or set up businesses in- or lend money to- then the UK's constructive world-wide presence must be maintained and enhanced...

One way towards this objective is the UK increasing its qualitative lead in TV, Radio & Internet-delivered* news, business, human/social-interest and entertainment media...

(* via desk-top computer, lap-top computer, set-top box AND MOBILE PHONE/POCKET PC)...

Unfortunately, the country's defacto 'world emissary'- the BBC- is at risk of being rendered 'UK-bound', neutered and gagged- due to unbelievably short-sighted long-term inadequate funding...

Many of the BBC's best TV/Video programmes can't be accessed from overseas anymore...

Its previously award winning web site has been significantly degraded over the last 25 months... contradicting Labour's oft stated objective that it wants the country to lead the world in Internet technology...

While the BBC's web site has been substantially dumbed down, its (previously) extensive resources of news, business, human interest & other information types- available in text, audio & video formats- have been significantly reduced both in scope & quality...

The depth of web-site reporting has- viewed from over here in North America- been gutted while a large amount of the BBC's Internet-delivered TV programmes & TV channels have short sightedly been walled-off from 'outside of UK' access...

As of about 11-months ago, overseas persons wanting to access the BBC's web site content are served material that is significantly inferior to what UK residents receive- and often with inane, tasteless commercials...

Even the BBC's World Service radio stream does not work on mobile phones/pocket PC's anymore...

What is constructive or 'good for UK business or international politics interests' in this situation?

The BBC's world-leading quality radio stations and their respective programmes used to have comprehensive explanatory text on their individual web home pages- not any more: many of the new virtually blank web pages have none or counterproductively little text explaining individual programmes' topics...

This would not be so bad if the BBC iplayer would work outside of the UK so that overseas persons could still access the BBC's vastly superior TV/video format news, business, human interest, sports, arts and social-topic
Internet-delivered media...

But the BBC iplayer has been programmed deliberately to not fully-function outside the UK... so that the UK's best, world-beating TV/video programmes- such as Newsnight, Panorama, Click, FastTrack, HardTalk, Our World, Dateline London, Reporters and even the daily TV/video news broadcasts (like the 10 O'clock News)- are no longer viewable over the Internet from outside the UK...

This would make sense, possibly, if overseas persons were enabled to pay for iplayer use, maybe in the form of a monthly, yearly or even a weekly 'subscription'... similar to what RealPlayer markets to potential customers for access to its 'premium' services...

Instead of this, hugely counterproductive media-access walls are being erected around the UK...

MP's, prospective MP's and political party members ought to be considering the above & deliberating whether a viable objective would be:

1) getting rid of the clearly inadequate TV license method of funding the BBC &

2) switching to an annual 'media tax' applicable to adult UK residents... with partial or full rebates available to low-income persons...

SHORT revenue generating commercials could be inserted at the beginning of BBC TV programmes that are accessed via the Internet from overseas- as US stations like MSNBC and others do...
=====================

Prospective MP's and political party members also ought to be asking:

- 'how can the UK most effectively advertise & promote itself in the coming decades??'

Without the, for over 1/2 a century, world renowned and unrivaled, BBC- enabled to function at its best- the UK risks being written off as a 'useless', 'lost cause', 'not good investment location' by those observing from overseas.....


___________________
Roderick V. Louis,
Vancouver, Canada

THE GAFFER'S 24/365 SLOGAN REVEALED

"Yesterday was yesterday."


Yesterday
All those bigots seemed so far away
Now they tell me I must always say:
Oh - yesterday was yesterday.

A jury of twelve good men and true have decided - IMHO quite rightly - that sex workers are entitled to be able to work in a place of safety.

Hooray for common sense!

A member of the judiciary has said ....

Christian belief should not be give a special place in british law as it would be divisive.

Hooray for common sense! Again!

(Twice in one day, my goodness!! 2010 finally or what?

One must hope that this principle applies to all religions and faiths and does not exclude those faiths hat might threaten to take to a call to arms on the basis that they find it offensive that their religion - any religion - is not given special treatment!



An interesting - and well observed - post at No. 45 yesterday!

Many a true word can be said in a blog post!


Regarding the - logical - outcome of the trial against the teacher ....

No doubt there will be ‘dizkushuns’ now to deal with the ‘ishoo’ of classroom behaviour(?)

As (I’ve) said before .... the effective rules have long been in place. It is the failure of the schools - and their insurance companies - to properly apply the legislation that has let the educators, those to be educated and society down.... Badly!



Good to see that Mr Mandelson has a sense of humour!

His Postman Pat impersonation is a gem!




A seven letter word, that is three letters longer than that so famously used by Mr Tynan, has been published on-line by the BBC.

OK! So it’s in inverted commas!

But has the Beeb finally got into the 21st century?

Or is it a radio mike-less gaffe?

And, if so, will it get 36 hours of - seemingly endless - repetition, analysis and opinion?

#10 gnuneo (and your previous #63)

I concur with much of your analysis; you refer to early ‘minority reports’ but as the gnu kid on the blog you may not be aware than several of us have constantly argued that uncontrolled immigration and the power of EU have been the main elephants in the room. Financial crisis can eventually be overcome, but total distortions to our society will grow exponentially and will never be reversible.

Others have blogged that this is no accident or incompetence, but a deliberate policy to dumb-down and thereby control society. However, two issues on which I do not entirely agree with you are Minimum Wage, and the Green Party.

Although the gap between Benefits and the Minimum Wage has resulted in too many people opting for the unemployed lifestyle and single parent status, these options should be eliminated by means other than upping the minimum wage. When compared with wage rates in less developed countries our Min Wage (plus benefits) has acted as the magnet that pushes work overseas and attracts immigrants seeking an hourly rate that is equal to a day’s pay in their countries.

Also, if the election of Westminster MPs and Local Government Councillors is to have any real purpose, we must free ourselves from the ever-tightening control from Europe, which shows many examples of vested interest by the main members and future problems for UK from rapid EU expansion adding more poor countries and inevitable immigrants .

However, I accept that the Green Party fits my ‘Vote Radical’ call as a major aim must be to get a ‘balanced’ parliament that will have some strong voices for changes in electoral reform, without which we will remain locked into the BIG 3

#13 kash
"Mandelson's Cheshire cat impersonation is working to its logical conclusion; next Friday, all that will remain will be the smile."

Maybe the Cheshire Cat smile is in anticipation of a future in which NuLbour still gets most seats, and Gordo get the 'lateral arabesque' leaving room for a smug contender?

#24 Ah very witty post Barrie ; )

IF ONLY DAWKINS WERE NOT SUCH A DAWK! (#25)

The secular world needs to come (quietly and rationally) together and demand that all those religions DECIDE ON JUST ONE 'TRUTH' - then it can be negated in the interest of a better life.

I assert that religion arises from the common experience imprinted on all human individuals, immediately after birth, THAT THERE IS AN ALL PERVASIVE, INEFFABLE POWER UP/OUT THERE. This is the source of religious 'inner certainty'.

BBC's FUNDING OUGHT TO BE INCREASED!!

PART 2:

ALL MAJOR UK POLITICAL PARTIES OUGHT TO BE DELIBERATING HOW THE BBC's FUNDING CAN BE INCREASED OVER THE LONG TERM: UNTILL THE RAPIDLY EVOLVING HIGH TECH/NEWS, ENTERTAINMENT, BUSINESS & HUMAN-INTEREST MEDIA-DELIVERY INDUSTRY STABILIZES, THE BBC CAN'T BE TOO BIG!!

Even when times are tough & finances at their grimmest- families & small businesses that have common sense 'keep up appearances' & make sure that the family's or business's outward facing facade remains stable & retains continuity...

Why should these practices not apply to countries facing financial challenges, especially those with central roles on the world's most important political, economic & security structures- such as the UK?

Making cuts & negative spending adjustments internal to the UK generally may be advisable & necessary during these challenging times....

But, today's world economic situation calls for an expansion, not reduction, in national-institutions that are as fundamental to how the UK is perceived around the world as the BBC...

To assist the City/London retaining its title of 'world financial centre' there needs to be a UK based 24-hour business-news world TV channel- with its own designated Internet resources- accessible world-wide....

The BBC's excellent business news reporting capabilities could be partnered with another quality UK Mark such as the Financial Times to fill this role ably.

What is good for the UK or the world economy generally by the US's Bloomberg & CNBC continuing to monopolize the 24-hour world business news TV/video space??

Until the world and UK economies stabilize & until the rapidly evolving Internet reaches at least a modicum of stasis, the BBC- particularly its Internet-accessible text, audio & video services- ought to be as liberally funded as is reasonably possible...

Politicians ought to give their collective heads a shake and ask themselves what will be left for the UK to brag about & to enable it to 'stand apart from the rest of the world' in a useful, constructive, positive way- if the BBC is allowed to be destroyed due to inadequate long-term funding and its resulting incompetent long-term objective setting...

A properly funded & resourced BBC should be enabled to compete at its best globally and to function effectively as a first rate shop window for the UK- keeping the country in the forefront of the world's peoples, political leaders & business professionals/entrepreneurs minds...



_________________
Roderick V. Louis,
Vancouver, Canada

Tough Times Ahead? No Worries

https://news.uk.msn.com/world/articles.aspx?cp-documentid=153216380

With the full effects of the financial crisis about to be revealed, unemployment and higher taxes imminent, we might all be queueing up for courses on this technique later this year. Should help with overpopulation too.

Get real, Gordi, get real!

Did I hear right? Did Gary Gibbon just say that Lord Blair of Basra will be on the stump for three days for Labour?

Divorced from reality?

Well I'll go to the foot of our valley!

11. At 1:06pm on 28 Apr 2010, thegangofone wrote:

On this page when you come across posters who "don't like to visit London due to the racial mix" the best you can do is point out that there is no science behind the notions of racial difference and the differences that do exist are cosmetic adaptations to climate.


It’s true there is no difference - racially, there's a big difference - culturally,

Middle eastern people, Indians and Pakistani’s practice honour killings, for people of their own family that:

1. Dress unacceptably
2. Choosing to marry by own choice or not wanting to be part of an arranged marriage
3. Sex outside marriage.

From Africans we have witchcraft. In 2005, three Angolans in London were jailed over the torture of an eight-year-old relative they accused of being a possessed witch. The girl was beaten, cut and had chilli peppers rubbed in her eyes to "beat the devil out of her".

Spirit possession is a common feature of African traditional religion and there is a belief that they can fly or mutate into other creatures.


Finally from the wahabbis we have women dressed in burkas, being totally submissive to there husbands.


Immigrants should be allowed into the country, but only those that agreed and abide by our modern, secular democratic laws.

There is no place in this country for blatant sexism from wahabbis, or mediaeval practices of witchcraft and honour killings.

Took me two goes to steal myself for it but Wednesday with Jeremy on ItotallyagreewithGillianIjustmisheardthestupidbatthefirsttimeroundgate in the end surprisingly palatable. Richard Watson's report appreciated with reservations and the panel discussion good value. In the panel there was a reference from Peter Hyman to the 1992 Sheffield Labour Conference and I did think to check out the full horror of that on YouTube (1:32 is where it starts to get really icky)and right all this small beer by comparision.

Some requests 1 Richard Watson's report indeed appreciated (I also love the camera panning around the actually surprisingly not so enormous crowds congregating at doorsteps and by all means do please linger) but there was some superficiality concerning the distinction between EU and non-EU immigration which needs addressing 2 Peter Hyman's remarks about the Cameron shoe-in and the easy ride he's getting from the media also need taking up.

As for the Manifesto Anthems my guess is that 18 years on they will be seen as naff as Cliff Richard's Eurosong performances of yesteryear or for that matter the Sheffield 1992 glitz linked above. I should think it quite likely the youth vote will be decisive in this election - this is simply trivialising it.

Would this be the first time Newsnight has addressed the Greek crisis? Surely not but it did look like it.

https://www.clearbooks.co.uk/blog/2010/04/29/2010-election-survey-business-the-economy/

The above election survey was offered to members of petrol prices.com to partake in, but other non specified organisations may also have taken part ?

I wonder why Gordi seems 'fit' to imitate my arm and hand movements on ice? He just looks ridiculous.

arm and hand movements on ice as per today's homepage, for example

gnu #various

In response to your several apparent party political broadcasts for the Green Party its only fair to point out that the Germans have been creating alleged green jobs in low carbon energy for several years now. Despite the fact that Germany is a bigger country than ours, they are alleged to have only created 100.000 jobs in alleged green industry, far below the 1.2 million Brown claims are possible.

I suspect that all three main party leaders will trot out the green jobs delusion in tonight's debate in order to appease the potential eco-fascist vote. However the Greens were only polling just over 3% in a facebook poll, perhaps due to the fact that 34% were leaning to the Lib-Demmics. ( more than the Tories in second )

Is The UK Preparing To Follow PIIGS Into The Abyss

https://www.zerohedge.com/article/uk-preparing-follow-piigs-abyss

I'd recommend everyone read The Modern Survival Manual: Surviving the Economic Collapse, ISBN 9870563457 about how a man and his family survived the Argentine economic collapse, I had to order a copy from the US as I could not find it here, not a page turner, but it covers everything you'll need, he also has a blog with all the information in it if you have the time and inclination to dig through it-

https://ferfal.blogspot.com/

Re: The Electoral Debate

What we witnessed tonight was a reversed order. Methinks deluded pretenders are still 'dreaming'.

Personally, I don't see myself like that but perhaps I seem 'lovable'?

mim

Yet again Gordon Brown talks of either jobs or training for young people. My grandson (16) cannot get a job and has not been offered any training! The powers that organise these things tell him that neither is available. He would love to be able to work ( I may point out that, at 16, he is also NOT eligible for any monetary support from the state). Does Mr Brown really know what's happening in the UK?

Cameron was a little too over-confident in his refusal to answer Clegg/Brown questions about capping migration of people from the Euro Zone . . . then I realised . . . perhaps Cameron & Co are planning to exit UK Plc completely from European Legislation and therefore he may do as he pleases with 'capping' migration from anywhere . . . am concerned if this is the case, then where does that leave the economic recovery for Great Britain . . . in 'Splendid Isolation'?

Cameron lost my vote when he started saying he would take away benefits for the 11 million jobless to pay for middle class tax cuts! Is he mad?

He missed the fact that he could save some 16 billion pounds by removing means testing for core benefits, close the failed jobcentre organisation and move distribution to consolidate with local authority housing benefit.

#38:

the direct influence of 100,000 Green jobs is not limited purely to the jobs themselves, it is also the goods and services those workers consume with their earnings.

also, Germany has not gone *full in* with the Green economy, AND they also already have a substantial manufacturing sector. We would need to rebuild whole sectors to achieve the change, for instance Germany still has open steel mills, whereas *we* will have to reopen them. Equally, Germany has a strong automobile industry, but we will have to rebuild it to manufacture hybrid/high fuel economy cars.

plus, something Germany has not done much, is investing in permaculture agriculture, growing food with very low oil uses to protect ourselves against another oil crisis. This could easily absorb 500,000 plus people back onto farmland, we currently have a bare 40,000 farmers left in the UK.

there is a *need* for the goods and services that the Green Economy will create, and a *need* to employ people productively.

frankly, there is little other choice, where else are the jobs going to come from to regrow the UK economy? From the Financial Sector?

without Govt intervention and support, it is only the Financial Sector that has the free cash to invest in employing people - instead, they are still handing out £Bs in bonuses to very few.

i hate to say it, but we have little choice. The only choices is *which* Party is most trustable to achieve these investments and changes.

#40: "Lovable"?? Well certainly ..."Interesting"! :* xxx

What is the problem with Brown looking at his opponents? Cameron's gaze down the tv lens and into my living room makes me want squat him like an annoying fly (it is much more disturbing than that and he appears salesman like, of course, I find him wholly unconvincing)...it is a debate, not a a tv performance. Look at your opponents.

THE WINNER? STYLE OVER SUBSTANCE - SON ET LUMIERE.

There it was: Britain's problem in full colour - and sequential change too! Debate? What debate! Didn't you catch the background?

While the three stooges wittered, the total lack of GRVITAS, in todays Britain, was played out behind them. WHY?

Were the audience so short of attention span - was the verbal stimulation of such low order as to need visual input, or the audience would fall into a torpor? OR HAD THE POWERS OF 'EDGY' WON THE DAY AGAIN?

Did the three leaders agree to be dominated by a carnival light show, that screamed of a gravitas-free event? What have we come down to? WE no longer KNOW HOW to do gravitas. Did everyone go home with a balloon and a kiss from Peter Mandelson? I AM BEYOND DESPAIR.

Perhaps the shiny green wheels of the Climate Change Scam are starting to come loose, it would appear that Brown has revised his green jobs aspiration down two thirds to 400,000 from his original 1.2 million claims . Those of you who follow this blog regularly may have seen the Glen Beck / Fox News link I posted the other night which pins the whole climate scam project firmly on the financial interests of Goldman Sachs. Our country can simply not afford the 18 Billion a year " welfare state for the stock market parasites " any projected UK alleged " green investment " represents.

Well I thought the Crick reporting of the Gove allegation that Clegg had lied about the long term commitment to the Euro was tripe - as the quoted manifesto entry said it was long term.

Ashdown rebutted it well.

I think Labour did do better and Brown did not crack as I expected - in fact Clegg looked very wobbly on the amnesty and that was his worst moment to date. The policy itself could in fact be practical as it reduced the criminal economy and increases the legal one.

But Labour look to me to be set to flatline or even possibly dip. If Alistair "the rabbit" Campbell apparently thinks they have had it so do Labour beneath the spin and bravado.

The Tories could pick up but I would imagine that still means they are well off majority government and may not beat Labour in seats.

If that is so then the notion of the first past the post system as being two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch is dead as the lamb, the Lib Dems, has become an equal competitor and the bias against them can't be sustained for much longer.

I vote Lib Dem but I have to agree that it is very poor as many, including Paul Mason, have pointed out that they did not really start scaling up the pain.

My understanding is that does not come (the tax rises) until later as it would be back-end loaded as it was put I think but that could have been made clearer.

All of the parties should perhaps have been made to comment on the whole strategy - perhaps it does not break down easily into soundbites but maybe they could have given their comprehensive strategies to the IFS for comment.

I'm crossing my fingers for a 'U.K. Sovereignty Act'.

Negating the necessity to comply with a raft of destructive E.U. legislation would increase company revenues (including the tax on that revenue) and, therefore, the ability to invest and hire again and speed-up the recovery.

A 'win/win' or 'win/win/win' situation.

Here's hoping.

#47:

so you believe that oil is infinite, and there are no pollution consequences from its use? Whether or not Climate Change is man-made or not, reversible or not, we MUST change to a low-oil-use economy, and that is going to require investments.

plus, we *need* to have new jobs, and as i said earlier, where else *can* they come from except in agriculture, manufacturing and infrastructure upgrading?

i think we have all seen the insanity of relying upon a corrupt Financial Sector for the entire budget.

gnu #44

Perhaps the one and only true reason Corus closed its Redcar plant was the fact that they could trouser the 600 million for the carbon credits they got for free. Any potential owner will have to purchase said carbon credits before it even thinks about re-bricking the blast furnaces so not much hope there. Of course the greens were all for the EU carbon trading scheme and also the Climate Change Act that will render perhaps hundreds of high energy demand companies worth more dead than alive. Even then those smaller companies not currently covered by said act can probably not withstand the projected 20% rise in energy bills to fund wind farms amply proven not to save a single gram of CO2. The Green idiot was whinging about traffic pollution in the politics show environment debate the other day, yet it was the greens and their eco-fascist NGO mates who pushed for the traffic calming which has doubled the pollution in our cities perhaps to a point worse than before the Clean Air Act in the 1950s ?

#46 There it was: Britain's problem in full colour - and sequential change too! Debate? What debate! Didn't you catch the background?

Barrie that background drove me to despair, what was it all about?!!!! I kept watching the searchlight going over their heads, and wondering which colour was going to fade first, and which was the darkest or the brightest.

Utterly ridiculous, who said medja students didn't find jobs, their everywhere at the beeb, being extremely edgy! ; )

Michael Crick had it right when he said that the main party leaders have nothing new to say. Of course they haven't: we've had their views constantly morning, noon and night for several weeks now. The disparity between their coverage and the other parties was brought into sharp relief tonight in a couple of ways.

Firstly, more debates were announced. One for Scotland. One for Wales. One for Northern Ireland. Anything missing there? Are the English just taken for granted?

There are some second rank parties who have a lot to say about England. Take, for example, UKIP. The BNP. The English Democrats. And I'm sure that the Christian Party/Alliance, the Green Party and Respect would have something new to say on the issues debated. But no, the media doggedly persisted with their policy of giving the three front runners an hour and a half to say what they wanted, followed by a couple of sentences each from only two of those other parties in the discussion afterwards.

Premier Radio is the only media outlet I know which has had a debate with just the minor parties; and it was riveting: by far more interesting than the other five of their debates which featured only the three front runners. Why can't the mainstream media get the idea?

Can't you people see that it is REALLY BORING?!!!!! Simply because there is absolutely nothing new to say when the three leaders have said it all a million times before. Hats off to the BBC for being able to sustain such long discussion programmes about it afterwards on two channels as the material was sooooo stale!

And even if you disagree with the lack of stimulating material, surely anyone can see after Nick Clegg's meteoric rise to poll ratings that these debates profoundly influence opinions; and that it is therefore very unfair and biassed to squeeze the other parties out in this way.

PLEASE don't leave the English out!
And get the other major parties debating to add a bit of interest to the discussion!

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

#26: hi indignant,

"I concur with much of your analysis; you refer to early ‘minority reports’ but as the gnu kid on the blog you may not be aware than several of us have constantly argued that uncontrolled immigration and the power of EU have been the main elephants in the room."

"gnu kid" lol :D

actually, i've been here a long time, i just move to other sites for periods. :)

we HAVE control, and we also are one of the main players in the EU. Less than a 1/4 of 1% of our population are added to our population, and many of those are from the EU.

Yes, we had large scale migrant workers coming in when east Europe entered the EU, but many of those migrant workers have no intention of staying - they came here to work, and to see what life in the UK is like. I wonder what they think of us now, some of them? We were regarded as one of the Pillars of Human Rights compared to the Soviet regimes, we were the yard-stick against which the Soviet system was judged and found failing. And now we have 'Little Englanders' throwing stones at their homes, blaming *them* for the incompetencies of our Ruling Class, and deliberate impoverishment of huge swathes of Britain.

"elephant in the room"? no, not really. The Elephant is actually that our economy has been shattered by greedy fools. Blaming "immigrants" for shortfalls in public services is entirely disingenuous, especially as it transpires that the immigrants paid FAR more in tax receipts than they took out of the system in services.

"Financial crisis can eventually be overcome, but total distortions to our society will grow exponentially and will never be reversible."

sorry, i think you're being silly. :)

UK culture is more than strong enough to either assimilate or tolerate the influx of a mere 1/4 of 1% of our population. Doctor Who and Question Time are high enough quality that they don't need protection from "immigrants"! :D


"Although the gap between Benefits and the Minimum Wage has resulted in too many people opting for the unemployed lifestyle and single parent status, these options should be eliminated by means other than upping the minimum wage. When compared with wage rates in less developed countries our Min Wage (plus benefits) has acted as the magnet that pushes work overseas and attracts immigrants seeking an hourly rate that is equal to a day’s pay in their countries."

while to some extent that is true, the solution is not a global drive to reduce wages everywhere (have you not noticed the prices of goods and services does not fall along with incomes?), it is to promote the capitalist-partnership/cooperatives structures. For instance, Infinity Foods is not going to move its employment to other countries because the company 'cannot afford' the wage costs. Neither would Cadbury's be closing factories to move production overseas. Nor would the last Steel Mills be closing by their foreign owner. Your economic structure is sound - your solutions are not.

also, by supporting cooperatives instead of corporations we will start to reduce the enormous Wealth Gap, AND bring democracy further into the workplace, AND secure British Jobs for British Workers. And we will reduce the need for a minimum wage - let the workers themselves, as part of the managerial decision-making process, set their wage levels. It is THEIR company - they *want* it to succeed.

remember the Thatcherite insistence on 'self-interest'? She was right about that - curious how she never applied it to citizens owning their own workplaces.


"Also, if the election of Westminster MPs and Local Government Councillors is to have any real purpose, we must free ourselves from the ever-tightening control from Europe, which shows many examples of vested interest by the main members and future problems for UK from rapid EU expansion adding more poor countries and inevitable immigrants ."

y-e-e-s-s, i kind of agree with that - certainly there needs to be a redrawn Constitution that IS put before the Citizens of Europe to vote on, a Constutution that legally *forces* both universal Rights of the Individual/Child, also puts decisions making powers down as far as possible towards the People.

my own take however is that a withdrawal from the EU would put FAR too much power back into the hands of ...*unelected* bureaucrats in Whitehall, and barely electable politicians in Westminster. The EU is already facing a massive crisis through the Euro, we can use this opportunity to reconstruct the European Project. And i certainly would object to Turkey's entry.


"However, I accept that the Green Party fits my ‘Vote Radical’ call as a major aim must be to get a ‘balanced’ parliament that will have some strong voices for changes in electoral reform, without which we will remain locked into the BIG 3"

thank you.

may i say it was quite pleasurable reading your post? :)

#52 A question b99, do Tata now own Corus, or have I got the wrong company? Did I read that Tata are now building this factory in India? With the 600 million they got? Or have I got that all wrong? And presumably none of this carbon control or tax applies to India?

#52:

am i wrong in regarding your examples as being where a Green idea was supported, and then diverted, by pro-centralised control multi-nationals?

i would certainly agree that all ideas can be subverted, and that even with that some of the Green ideas are silly and unfounded, but the simple fact remains:- *where* are the new jobs we *need* going to come from, except the Green Economy?

A great piece by Deborah Ross in the Independent

"How exciting! I've never met proper racists before"

Just a snifter of her day out with Nick Griffin of the odious BNP:
'
We end up in a pub on the Goresbrook Road, where we drink beer outside in the sun. Have you seen Shane Meadows's film, This Is England, I ask Nick. "Yes," he says. And? "It wasn't particularly good. It was shallow propaganda." A black fella walks by with one of those old-fashioned, Victorian bulldogs. It's a lovely dog, if called Razor, so Terry and I get up to make a big fuss of it. "Great dog," says Terry, to the owner. "Cheers," says the owner. Terry, who would still be nameless if only he were, then says: "See? We're not so bad. We talk to darkies."
'

Some people can say so much without saying anything much!

PREPARING CHILDREN FOR A FULFILLING LIFE

The Three Bananoes made absolutely no mention of mothers as the primary nurture that - along with breast feeding - launches a newborn with some chance of effective maturity.

Thatcher KNEW that money was the key to all goodness, and she sold it to Westminster, of all colours. But credits and pre-schools can bear NO RESEMBLANCE, in terms of the five (perhaps six) senses of a raw new being, to MOTHER. Mother is unique to each child.

British culture has devalued childbirth to an ordeal, and child-nurture to a chore. First we stigmatised 'housewife' until kids all had latch-keys, and now we have devalued motherhood to the point where the womb is on a par with the appendix. Bravo Britain. It does not take a genius to see that male values have triumphed, largely through the agency of aberrant females, and enough generations have passed such that the way back has 'grown over'.

Children are now routinely born to older, work-orientated women. This is not a route to a stable, fulfilling life. What is left of the post-war population, is getting madder. Don't believe me? Take a look at the three who say they will mend Broken Britain! They have no idea that the drift from mothering is our fundamental problem. They think it is jobs, policing and a third runway.

I could be wrong but none of the debates tackled whether we will be ready to cope with the projected 2020 carbon shortfall.

There also has not even been much progress on these new lightning fast nuclear reactors that Labour were allegedly going to knock up and leave lots of glowing waste everywhere that we can't find a place to keep.

When Gordon Brown said we can trust him on the economy, I thought we are 1.3 trillion pounds in debt because of new labour’s handling of the economy. It put me right off new labour. I was expecting Gordon Brown to crack under the pressure during the debate, and people to see his true colours of a tub thumping and lecturing presbyterian. Alas, it didn’t happen, though there’s still plenty of time until election day. Gordon Brown is uncomfortable with modern media: TV, internet, and especially radio mics !

Nick Clegg looked very wobbly on the amnesty for immigration and scraping the pound for the euro. Other than that he was OK.

Cameron, looked angry that he’s been up staged by Clegg, since the first debate, that’s why he went on the attack against the Liberals.

I certainly don’t like the idea of the Tories welfare reform, it’s the same story from new labour, forcing the unemployed into low paid jobs with hardly any employment protection. People in low paid jobs can easily be sacked by being stitched up by their unscrupulous employer.

Though I do like the Tories idea of the big society, people helping themselves rather than relying on Uncle Gordon.

Overall I think Cameron won by a wide margin from Clegg. Brown still in third, he’s looks shifty to me, by not looking into the camera, he’s not being honest with people.

I am from another European country but have lived in this country for 12 years, I don't have the right to vote for general election but can vote at local and European elections.
I am a taxpayer and therefore I have an interest in the outcome of this election. What seems terribly frightening to me is the discrepancy between the voters expectations and the reality of the task at hand for the next government.
If you focus not on the delivery but on the validity and the basis of the arguments made on each of those televised debate, I must say that Gordon Brown convince me the most in terms of having the knowledge and the understanding of what it takes to execute the necessary and difficult decisions to support the recovery.
The other two candidates despite their genuine personal convictions that they have the right ideas in place have no experience of the consequences of their proposed plans.
Gordon Brown and his government have been containing the haemorrhage and need to be given the chance to stop it and help the country regain the strength it needs to stand up again in the global economic world.
There is no such thing as a sovereign country anymore, the spheres in which the drivers of an economy live are not limited to what is happening in the UK, the UK is part of a system that is greater than its geographical borders and to protect what exist within its borders, the voters need to ensure they elect someone who has the gravitas required to lead a country both at the national and international level.
With no real alternative, Brown comes across has a man of integrity whose profound dedication is put to the service of his country and not to serve personal ambitions, he has already achieved that.
Let him finish the job, and in five years time let’s revisit his performance.

#60:

'jobs' *is* important in this debate - it is the cooperative companies that have taken the lead in flexi-time working, in both maternity and paternity leave. Also child-care, and crèches. This is hardly surprising, as it is what the workforce want, and when they organise themselves it is natural they give themselves what they want - profits to tax-havens are not as important to people working in cooperatives, it seems. Britain is not *really* "broken", it is just bent into a violent, exploitative structure. It will take a while to change back to a healthy, productive structure, but as we ALL want that it is certainly not impossible.

its got to be better than massive cuts and a return to pre-Welfare State unemployment, poverty and wide-spread crime though, surely??

----

#61:

Sir Humphrey would undoubtedly be impressed with that! ;)


...if only it *were* just a game, and not playing with our children, and grandchildren's future. And, in fact, our very own. :/

THINK 'TONY' AND BE AFRAID (#63)

"Brown comes across as a man of integrity whose profound dedication is put to the service of his country and not to serve personal ambitions, he has already achieved that."

We are still living within the Westminster Lie and the feudal powers of our Prime Ministers continue to increase. Brown is deeply flawed. He is a product of the same genesis as Blair. Take a hard look at Blair, and a long look at Brown.

gnu #51

I realise that you a very recent newcomer to the newsnight blog but without having to go back through at least 3 years of my contributions perhaps you don't get the full picture. I more than anyone understand the need to make our global oil resources last as long as practically possible but to do that you can't rule out either coal or nuclear. Simple relatively cheap retro road improvements could cut road transport emission by 10%, likewise increasing some speed limits back to 1960s default. The trouble is that the eco-fascists have would appear ro have infiltrated the key positions in the civil service and therefore the true science is ignored by government. Incidentally I would join the Green Party tomorrow if they dropped all links to potentially corrupt eco-fascist NGOs like FoE who knew that traffic calming doubled pollution as long ago as 1996, and their false environmentalism. Incidentally I can true " out left " most people on most days except that I am in no way an authoritarian Stalinist ?

#54 How right you are Ann! If you read here hardly anyone comments on these "debates", because as you say we've heard it all before. You have to search to find any other parties manifesto, they are on the internet. But it would be nice of the biased BBC to let us HEAR what other parties have to say, but they like it all neat and tidy, and just the big 3 get air time.

#60 Spot on Barrie! Mothers are almost non beings now in the UK, and I think in other parts of europe. Look at the decline in birthrate in of all places, Italy, France and Spain. Known for having large families. Now immigrants are the main replacement of our non babies.

Children are only seen as a commodity to fill the great maw of political amibition, and the women who produce these children as just breeder/workers, just as in the bee hive. Only the great PM is seen as omnipotent.

The failure of the family is the biggest problem ever to hit this country, in fact Cameron is mildly right when he says get back to society values and responsibility, which are totally lost here, we have no cohesion anymore. We have no belief in us as a nation, just look at #63 Firmbeliever post, we are just a part of europe, not an individual country with own rights and aspirations.

#66 b99 and gnuneo don't think there's much hope for the oil lasting very long.....

once a billion Indians a billion Chinese have a car it will vanish within years.

BORDER AGENCY JOB CUTS

Heard on my local (Kent) BBC news this morning. The border agency is going to be cut to 145 out of a total of 185, although 11 are moving to Sussex.

Glad to see the importance the government is putting on legal and illegal immigration into the country. The illegal ones don't all fly into Gatwick and Heathrow, they creep in, by many ways around the ports of Kent.

One scam is to sit the illegal in the back of the car, pretending he's asleep or drunk, with passengers either side, and they let him slide in. Having left the original centre seat passenger in France, who then comes home as a foot passenger. We need MORE not less border staff.

Ann Burgess #54


Against my better judgement I once more find myself posting on the Newsnight blog. I did not watch last night's 3 way pantomime on TV (I knew it was a pantomime from the cast list) but have been asked to say, by a previous poster that:

"For Gods sake please concur with her that as previous, now persona non
grata, posters have said for some time in this blog and elsewhere, this
forced-choice of three liberal-democratic parties is contrived. One can
choose a Social-Democratic sweetie (aka NeoConservativism or
neoliberalism, call it what one likes) with either a red, blue or yellow
wrapper. They all taste the same. It's designed that way. The market
markers don't want anyone upsetting their trades."

Speaking of tasting the same, (and without the assistance of edgy TV extravaganzas) I can confidently say, without a shadow of doubt, that the Lib Dems will do very well in the west country. This was made clear last evening whilst shopping in the Bideford branch of Asda. In an aisle near the 'bakery' was a three tier rack of cup cakes. The bottom shelf was full of cakes with red icing. The middle shelf was three quarters full of cakes with blue icing and the top shelf was completely empty apart from a few yellow crumbs. MORI - eat your heart out!

I think both these groups of people will be protected by the Human Rights Act....

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8652861.stm

https://www.scottishsundayexpress.co.uk./posts/view/172067/-8m-scandal-of-the-illegal-stoo-violent-to-deport

But what about Belgium and British Rights?

What Lib Dems and Cleggy would cost us if illegal immigrants were given an amnesty.....

https://www.migrationwatchuk.org/briefingPaper/document/189

Now I'll shut up! ; )

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/29/goldman-sachs-case-sent-t_n_557884.html

I very much hope they fully understand the terms that the financial nerds and Goldman gang thought up to make sure they can be engaged effectively. But just the news of this should affect prices, I'll have a keen eye today and next week. Could be the beginning of the end for Goldman Sachs.

I'm more or less just repeating earlier posts, but what a waste of time the leaders debates are. At last Merv has got something correct - the austerity which is coming our way is going to be far, far worse than the leaders are willing to talk about. All that rubbish about not being able to be specific about spending cuts becuase there has been no spending review is just that - rubbish. The truth is that spending will be determined by the bond markets - by instituitions which in many cases the taxpayer has just directly or indirectly bailed out. Will they let Cameron increase the IHT threshhold to £1m? Will they allow Cameron and Brown to mainatin universal choild benefit? Will they let Clegg effectively introduce a £10k personal allowance for people earning up to £100k? (I have to say that this proposed increase in personal allowance is the most disingenious part of the Lib Dems plans; as Clegg admitted to Paxman, it will cost around £17bn but only £1.5bn will go to those earning £10k and less per year. It is really a tax bribe for the middle classes, not some attempt to makle the system fairer for those at the bottom).

I reckon that we could well be heading towaqrds another European banking crisis brought on by the emerging soveriegn debt crisis. If it happens, and the UK banks (which hold over £100 bn of Greek, Spanish, Portuguese and Italian soveriegn debt) go back to the government for another bail out then (a) can the UK bail them out again; and (b) what will the average man on the street think about the bonuses which the banks have started paying out again?

#52/66 brossen99

“Simple relatively cheap retro road improvements could cut road transport emission by 10%, likewise increasing some speed limits back to 1960s default. ……traffic calming doubled pollution as long ago as 1996.”

Can't quite follow the maths there bro. If traffic calming doubled pollution why will retro-action only cut emissions by 10%?

However, having just received an 'Invitation to Pay a Fixed Penalty' for a minor speed transgression, I support your comment on speed limits!
I hate the '50% discount for immediate payment' bribe that discourages the option of explaining one's mitigating circumstances to an impartial magistrate; another decency of yesteryear before the motorist became the cash cow for central and local government.

Barrie # 60 - very true. The evidence shows that children brought up in traditional families tend to do better but of course if the evidence doesn't suit the political objectives, it is ignored. I have observed enough to understand that it is better for young children to be raised by their parents than to be farmed out to carers in nurseries often paid the minimum wage. By the way, this is not intended as an insult to child care workers; I simply know from my own experience that my interest in, love for and tolerance of my own children far exceeds that for other children. It is only natural, in my view.

REQUESTING PERMISSION TO VENT EXTREME SPLEEN.

Since Mrs Duffy raised immigration, all I hear from pious politicians is the word 'ENRICH' and their pronouncement of the 'Great Truth' that the NHS could not function without imported staff.

When 'ENRICH' falls on my ear, the associated word 'MANGLISH' pops into my head. In recent time, I have had experience of Manglish speaking medical staff - IT WAS NOT ENRICHING, either for myself or my confused, stroke-afflicted brother.

If that makes me a bigot, I look forward to a cup of tea with Mrs Duffy. Heaven forefend that I should ever take tea with a party politician.

END POLITICAL DISSEMBLING

Sometimes I despair.....
https://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/food_and_drink/real_food/article7112140.ece

A nursery school banned a 2 year old from eating a cheese sandwich.......I give up!

Indy # 76

The simple fact is that the traffic calming is not everywhere in the country, the 10% I quote is a projected combined national figure but removing traffic calming in towns will significantly cut pollution locally. A recent government report stated that the floated introduction of satellite speed limiters to ensure people stuck to the current speed limits less than 60 would increase pollution by 3%. However, I can't give you the link as it would appear to be broken, perhaps deliberately because it proves that going slower uses more more fuel and increases pollution, quite the opposite of what the eco-fascists attempt to portray ?

A SIMPLE TRUTH (AND A GIFT TO THE PC BULLIES)(#77)

Thanks nedafo2. I too respect those who give loving care to children. But my disrespect for a nation that measures its success in terms of GDP, nuke-ownership and wars started, above wellbeing, and contentment of its population, is unbounded.

We are a nation in a fairytale sleep, and real Princes are hard to find.

#56 gnueo

“we HAVE control, and we also are one of the main players in the EU. Less than a 1/4 of 1% of our population are added to our population, and many of those are from the EU”

Control? If you’re not a gnu kid on this blog then you would have seen the frequent links posted and outrage expressed at constant reversals of UK’s legal decisions by EU court (usually involving immigration cases, through adoption of their HR Act).

“UK culture is more than strong enough to either assimilate or tolerate the influx of a mere 1/4 of 1% of our population. Doctor Who and Question Time are high enough quality that they don't need protection from "immigrants"! :D

I don’t get that impression when I travel by bus or train and have to sit quietly (an old English habit) whilst the tower of babble erupts all round me from my garrulous and voluble fellow-travellers. World population has more than trebled in my lifetime and it seems that most of them are heading our way!

Despite your “sorry, i think you're being silly. :)” comment I repeat:
‘Financial crisis can eventually be overcome, but total distortions to our society will grow exponentially and will never be reversible.’

Look at the proportion of immigrants from the overpopulated third world’s poorest countries and compare their TFRs with the indigenes. And don’t let’s have Paxo’s startled look and idiotic question ‘define indigenes’. We English all know who we are, and many immigrants are too alien in cultural upbringing to ever assimilate to an English culture, which has already been changed beyond recognition.

“And i certainly would object to Turkey's entry.”

How do you intend that? Are we to get a referendum? Even so, it would be a rigged question and distorted by the growing number of ‘politically useful idiots’

“may i say , it was quite pleasurable reading your post? :)”

Thank you; likewise, although my main reason for posting is to leave an audit trail for my descendants who will be able to see that I did my best to protest at the government-inflicted ethnic cleansing of our country.

@ Barrie #78 - You couldn't be more wrong Barrie! The NHS certainly would not have been able to function without doctors from the Indian Subcontinent.

In the House of Lords in 1961, Lord Cohen of Birkenhead commented on the fact that:

‘The Health Service would have collapsed if it had not been for the enormous influx from junior doctors from such countries as India and Pakistan.’

and in fact, Enoch Powell as Minister of Health in 1963 who oversaw the first expansion of the NHS and was an architect of the policy of recruiting doctors from the Indian subcontinent.

:p would you have had the qualifications to become a doctor? No, thought not.

ON BUYING A PIZZA (additional to #78)

Does anyone here find it 'enriching' when faced with the wild-eyed bloke in the take-away? He has two words of MANGLISH and 'keep the change' (being three) throws him into fearful confusion. You leave convinced he is an illegal. Oh the multicultural joy of England, today.

32. At 8:10pm on 29 Apr 2010, kashibeyaz wrote:

Get real, Gordi, get real!

Did I hear right? Did Gary Gibbon just say that Lord Blair of Basra will be on the stump for three days for Labour?

Divorced from reality?

Well I'll go to the foot of our valley!



If this is true NuLabour really have lost it completely! Divorced from reality is the least of it !

The one thing I noticed about Brown in yesterday's debate he kept backing away from his lectern, putting his hands behind his back, and bowing his head. He looked like a naughty boy caught in the act !

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

the uk has a defacto illegal migrant amnesty.

the eu has them all the time and as there is free movement they can get an amnesty in spain or italy then come to the uk legally.

56. At 00:30am on 30 Apr 2010, gnuneo wrote:

we HAVE control, and we also are one of the main players in the EU. Less than a 1/4 of 1% of our population are added to our population, and many of those are from the EU.


ROFL, A quarter of 1% of our population is about 137,000 over 13 years of NuLab rule. You cannot be real! Over a million immigrants have come into this country over the past 13 years of NuLab rule.

Some of the foreigners are culturally alien to our modern secular democratic society.

In the past ten of thousands of immigrants have come into the country each year which is manageable on the resources for public services. More than 100,000 immigrants per year, have come into this country over NuLab’s rule, are very bad for social cohesion. I wouldn’t be surprised after the election, when massive job cuts from the public sector happen, that we will see race riots on the likes of the 1980's.

JUST CAUGHT A GLIMPSE OF TONY

Oh dear - he looks SOOOOOO embarrassed! He should be - his job is clearly to make Gordon uncomfortable and wrong foot him (as planned by Mandy and Campbell).

But is there a master plan? Or just nihilistic destruction.

I think these debates have changed the game; it is no longer Tory or Labour, and the growing strength of Plaid Cymru and the SNP will, coupled with the parlous state of the public finances, lead to new ways of doing business in the political sphere; no bad thing.

It will be important to come to some relatively quick and clear decisions about the deficit to avoid any hint of uncertainty developing in increasingly febrile markets, after next Thursday.

One can only hope that the smaller parties take a more responsible approach than the rather inward looking, parochial one they adopted in the Seventies, which brought down the then Labour government, allowing the original vampire squid, Thatcher, to let loose her evil magic on the country.

Isn't Alex Salmond very plausible, by the way? What he didn't tell the Birmingham audience on Questiontime last night was that he will not rule out his SNP MPs voting on purely English issues in Westminster as a quid pro quo for support for his agenda from a minority UK government.

Having your haggis and eating it?

Gordi tells us all now that Northern Rock was a small bank; so why did the taxpayer have to bail it out? A guarantee to savers would have been sufficient. I still don't understand how the global banking system would have collapsed, spelling disaster for us all if we/Gordi hadn't shovelled tons of public money down the banks' gullets. Some banks would have gone to the wall, for sure, but in a free market economy, isn't survival of the fittest one of the givens? Providing savings were protected, what's the problem?

I remember the collapse of BCCI in the early Nineties and, although there was a smaller guarantee to depositors then, many who had business loans from BCCI were "let off the hook", there being no-one to repay their loans to.

Look at the huge profits being recorded now by these same banks who needed a bail out. When will HMG recoup taxpayers' investments? Ever?

Are taxpayers' stakes in these banks too big to be profitably realised?

Vince, we need some advice.

#54 Ann Burgess.........best post on here for a while and I totally agree with every word (probably written out of total frustration and from the heart as well!).


#71 NewFazer....congrats on repsonding to #54

I also agree with your description of the event as pantomime.
If only the electorate knew the truth that we are all being taken for a ride.

...and re the comment...

"For Gods sake please concur with her that as previous, now persona non
grata, posters have said for some time in this blog and elsewhere, this
forced-choice of three liberal-democratic parties is contrived. One can
choose a Social-Democratic sweetie (aka NeoConservativism or
neoliberalism, call it what one likes) with either a red, blue or yellow
wrapper. They all taste the same. It's designed that way. The market
markers don't want anyone upsetting their trades."

I would also add that some 'previous posters' are very much missed on here and that they are certainly not 'persona non grata' as far as I am concerned.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLjbcU14T78

Gordon gets a mention over the pond.

#83 Mistress yes and isn't it disgusting that we take qualified doctors away from the third world, because we either don't train enough of our own, (I thought that was labours claim to increase doctors and nurses,) or they immediately go abroad to richer countries as soon as qualified.

A map of doctors in the world population...

https://strangemaps.wordpress.com/2007/10/17/185-the-doctorspatients-map-of-the-world/

Notice we have 460 patients per doctor in Britain, I note India has 1,700 -1,800 per doctor makes you really proud to be british. Stealing doctors and come to that many thousands of nurses from the poor.

Net immigration into this country is very high, the ONS says probably 3 million, and I have heard that it's as high as 11% of our population. I don't know where a quarter of one percent is from

https://www.migrationwatchuk.com/briefingpaper/document/170

From this article

Over 3 million immigrants under Labour

10 Thursdays figure for net immigration in 2008 of around 150,000 will have subtracted British emigration of about 90,000 so net foreign immigration will be approximately 240,000. The total of net foreign immigration 1997 2007 is already 2.67 million [9], so the total up to 2008 will be 2.91. Adding a cautious estimate of 200,000 for 2009, gives a total of 3.1 million immigrants during Labours term of office, leaving aside illegal immigration.

23 November, 2009

#82 indignantindegene

"Look at the proportion of immigrants from the overpopulated third world’s poorest countries and compare their TFRs with the indigenes."

Surely the issue for you is immigration numbers and not race? Fertility rates will depend a lot on culture and education and as has been identified by science on the genetic front there is virtually no difference between the races?

Fortunately everybody agrees that the BNP notions of significant racial differences exist only in their addled minds.

Go1 #96

"Fertility rates will depend a lot on culture and education and as has been identified by science on the genetic front there is virtually no difference between the races"

And your source is...? (And I don't mean TV journos.)

OH HOW I WANTED TO BE MRS DUFFY

Despicable Brown, with his 'one in one out' mantra, in response to Mrs D's immigration concern. Never a word or thought regarding the swapping of English speakers for Manglish ones (and a host of alien cultural 'enrichment').

I could not help a wry smile at the sprinkling of Manglish speakers in the audience of Question Time. One guy was as hard to understand as Kirsty!

I notice that, when killing Johnnie Foreigner, out squaddies do a lot of shouting, with great urgency, apparently to warn comrades. How does Manglish shouting fit in there?

96

israel has a race bias? some have even called it apartheid?

#66:

"Incidentally I would join the Green Party tomorrow if they dropped all links to potentially corrupt eco-fascist NGOs like FoE who knew that traffic calming doubled pollution as long ago as 1996, and their false environmentalism"

speed reductions have also saved lives. What is an associated policy, not yet implemented (it would have required forethought and initiative from our Govts, lol), is both hybridisation, and restrictions on gas-guzzlers.

and a HUGE benefit would be to complete the cycle-lane infrastructure, and flexi-time practices so that mums and dads can take their kids to school without having to use cars. And so people will cycle in general. Over 20% of Danes cycle every day, achieving not only far better health, but also low pollution.

just as a question, here in the UK, do you think oil companies have the ear of the Big 3£ more than cycle manufacturers? :/


#81 well spoken Barry.


#82: indignant,

"I don’t get that impression when I travel by bus or train and have to sit quietly (an old English habit) whilst the tower of babble erupts all round me from my garrulous and voluble fellow-travellers. World population has more than trebled in my lifetime and it seems that most of them are heading our way!"

as someone who has travelled fairly extensively globally, i can assure you that in every culture there are some who want to "sit quietly", and some who want to make noise. I know this may shock you, but such behaviour is not just English! :)

"We English all know who we are, and many immigrants are too alien in cultural upbringing to ever assimilate to an English culture, which has already been changed beyond recognition."

and they will either leave, or their children will grow up in *our* culture. They may be slightly different, due to cultural interaction, but then i would be horrified at a Culture that wanted - and aimed for - identikit kids. Muslim children growing up in the UK to immigrant parents (according to the tabloid press 'our worst nightmare') are VASTLY different to Muslim children born in say Pakistan. Immigrants to Britain are far more likely to assimilate than when *WE* went to their countries.

oh, and remember Change? Its a Good Thing for a Culture - *i* don't want to live in a isolated backwater. Especially not when our Culture is so strong and vibrant as it is today! :)


"“And i certainly would object to Turkey's entry.”

How do you intend that? Are we to get a referendum? Even so, it would be a rigged question and distorted by the growing number of ‘politically useful idiots’"

its a worry, but i do believe the EU has more to worry about now than expanding its borders. ;)

"Thank you; likewise, although my main reason for posting is to leave an audit trail for my descendants who will be able to see that I did my best to protest at the government-inflicted ethnic cleansing of our country."

lol, good for you. :D

btw, i've noticed that most UK born emigrants seem to be going to countries that are even MORE multi-cultural - Canada, New Zealand spring to mind.

perhaps its not the multi-culturalism that is making people leave, but an incompetent Govt and corrupt, exploitative economic systems? I shouldn't be surprised.


#89:

"ROFL, A quarter of 1% of our population is about 137,000 over 13 years of NuLab rule. You cannot be real! Over a million immigrants have come into this country over the past 13 years of NuLab rule."

do the math. Over 13 years, and only slightly over 1% of our current population is immigrant. Your own figures used. :)

"I wouldn’t be surprised after the election, when massive job cuts from the public sector happen, that we will see race riots on the likes of the 1980's."

neither would i, and it should be CLEAR to everyone that a powerful lobby in Westminster has been aiming for that. We are entering a period of change, either we invest in post-oil economics, and create vast amounts of new jobs within Britain, spreading wealth and rebuilding our economy, or else the poorest are to fight over what little scraps drop off the table of the Bankers and Uber-Wealthy. You see, if they are to pay taxes, they will leave the Country.

much better to beat up the helpless old Muslim woman next door, than to actually get the rich to pay their share of taxes for the benefit of the Society they live in.

the Uber-Wealthy owners of the tabloid press seem to agree with that, wouldn't you say? Gosh, what a shock! Such a pity *they* live in gated security mansions, instead of these neighbourhoods that will be torn apart.

a real pity.


#94:

indeed ecolizzy, it IS a disgrace. Worth remembering, as the Big 3£ are ALL claiming they want to "invest in training", that not ONE of them raised a peep when the nursing colleges were closed - for "efficiency savings" to boot, no doubt. Should give an inkling of how much we can trust them, IMHO.


#95: so the UK is attracting people to come here. Why is that so bad? And 2% over 10years is hardly being "swamped", especially as you have decided to remove the figures for *emigration*. Immigrants have children, and those children become British. This is the way of the World. Would our Culture be so strong and vibrant *without* all the immigration of the last 100years? Our Music, Sports, - even our diet and national recipes? We have only gained - what we *lack* is a decent Govt that is working for US, rather than Bankers and the Wealthy.